Beer Garden

Anything goes here.. :) Now with Beer Garden for our smoking patrons.
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Ho Really
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Re: Beer Garden

#3061 Post by Ho Really » Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:24 pm

SBD wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 11:04 am
I guess the alternate view is that "once it's all over", there will be a release of pent-up demand for holidays to catch up on the ones that people have missed.
Hopefully the isolation is not too long as it has been proven people caged up change psychologically. They become afraid to go out. I think most will be more positive. Keep an eye out for the cruise sector. There will be so much demand that there won't be enough cruise ships to go around. People will be flying again in all directions. Hotels will be booked. Prices are now very low and hopefully this will encourage people to book. Also I am hoping the tourism industry learns from this and put customers first when booking and cancelling, be less stringent in their terms and conditions.
As far as I can tell, cured people are immune to getting it again, so there will be an increasing number of safe tourists, and vaccine is expected to be widely available within 18 months for those of us who have not had it.
Not exactly right. You can get it again and die. It has happened in China. A vaccine is the only solution. Let's hope the trials in the USA, Israel and I think in Queensland are succesful. There could be others that I haven't read about. Of course it may be months before we see something concrete as vaccines must not have serious side-effects or else we'll cause more (unwanted) deaths.

Cheers
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Re: Beer Garden

#3062 Post by SRW » Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:44 pm

Ho Really wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:05 pm
SRW wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:42 am
Just to bring it home to our interest in developments here, I guess we can forget about any of the proposed hotels starting this year or even next? The tourism industry will take a long time to bounce back (especially as the worst is yet to come). Coupled with looming recession (from COVID-19, bushfires, and Coalition mismanagement) we're likely to see most CBD construction slow down. Exceptions may be civic construction (things like SAHMRI 2) or residential if government invests in social housing for stimulus.
No the tourism will not take a long time to recover. If we manage this virus with the isolation it deserves we'll be back to normal soon by end of year. The Chinese although secretive early on, and perhaps slow in a reaction, with the help of their political system have enforced a lockdown that now is producing positive results. Europeans (as in the EU) on the otherhand with their care-free attitude have exacerbated the whole issue. Like too many cooks in the kitchen.
Which is precisely why it will take longer to recover.
A recession yes, but not by government mismanagement. Bushfires and pandemics are not of the government's doing. Let's wait and see what the first part of the stimulus does and then wait for the second before you accuse anyone SRW.
You can be blind to it if you like, but the Coalition has done nothing to improve structural issues in the economy since they were first elected. It's not the whole story for why the economy is on the precipice, but it's certainly the precondition.
As for social housing, for whom? Yes civic construction, hospitals and clinics, public transport, roads and highways, schools and investment in trades, etc. Give people jobs and incentives not social experiments that have failed.
What I mean by social housing is not the stigmatised viewed you seem to take but rather something like the National Rental Affordability Scheme that was part of the Rudd government's package and saw projects like Uno and Ergo get off the ground here. But there are also other valid formats to pursue.
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Re: Beer Garden

#3063 Post by rev » Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:05 pm

Ho Really wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:05 pm
SRW wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:42 am
Just to bring it home to our interest in developments here, I guess we can forget about any of the proposed hotels starting this year or even next? The tourism industry will take a long time to bounce back (especially as the worst is yet to come). Coupled with looming recession (from COVID-19, bushfires, and Coalition mismanagement) we're likely to see most CBD construction slow down. Exceptions may be civic construction (things like SAHMRI 2) or residential if government invests in social housing for stimulus.
No the tourism will not take a long time to recover. If we manage this virus with the isolation it deserves we'll be back to normal soon by end of year. The Chinese although secretive early on, and perhaps slow in a reaction, with the help of their political system have enforced a lockdown that now is producing positive results. Europeans (as in the EU) on the otherhand with their care-free attitude have exacerbated the whole issue. Like too many cooks in the kitchen.

A recession yes, but not by government mismanagement. Bushfires and pandemics are not of the government's doing. Let's wait and see what the first part of the stimulus does and then wait for the second before you accuse anyone SRW.

As for social housing, for whom? Yes civic construction, hospitals and clinics, public transport, roads and highways, schools and investment in trades, etc. Give people jobs and incentives not social experiments that have failed.

Cheers
I think we will see more Australians travelling Australia when this is over at least initially.

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Re: Beer Garden

#3064 Post by rev » Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:15 pm

Ernst & Young from Wednesday will have all it's 6,000 staff in Australia working from home. But SCOMO still has his head up his own ass.

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Re: Beer Garden

#3065 Post by Llessur2002 » Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:56 pm

I wonder if one potential positive to this will be an increase in flexible working across the board? So many organisations all over the world who have never really embraced remote working (mine included) are now being forced into this by the current situation. Once it becomes apparent that many jobs can be done just as efficiently from home as they can in the office I think it will be difficult for organisations to refuse requests for home working arrangements from their staff - especially for those who have proven their ability to do this over the course of this pandemic. The potential savings in requirements for office space would surely be temping - if 1/3 of your workforce is at home on any given day then with hot desking a much smaller office would be required. Plus the other benefits in reduction of peak hour traffic and related emissions, space in the CBD required for parking etc.

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Re: Beer Garden

#3066 Post by rhino » Mon Mar 16, 2020 2:21 pm

rev wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:15 pm
Ernst & Young from Wednesday will have all it's 6,000 staff in Australia working from home. But SCOMO still has his head up his own ass.
Don't expect it to come out of there any time soon
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Re: Beer Garden

#3067 Post by OlympusAnt » Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:31 pm

Llessur2002 wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:56 pm
I wonder if one potential positive to this will be an increase in flexible working across the board? So many organisations all over the world who have never really embraced remote working (mine included) are now being forced into this by the current situation. Once it becomes apparent that many jobs can be done just as efficiently from home as they can in the office I think it will be difficult for organisations to refuse requests for home working arrangements from their staff - especially for those who have proven their ability to do this over the course of this pandemic. The potential savings in requirements for office space would surely be temping - if 1/3 of your workforce is at home on any given day then with hot desking a much smaller office would be required. Plus the other benefits in reduction of peak hour traffic and related emissions, space in the CBD required for parking etc.
When I've been overseas, I see people working remotely while living in another country.

Someone who say is employed in London could work remotely and live in a flat in Poland for €300 a month rent.

(not sure how that works with Brexit but who cares)
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Re: Beer Garden

#3068 Post by rev » Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:20 am

https://twitter.com/JasonYanowitz/statu ... 3653687296

I know it's Twitter, but give it a read it's about how it went down in Italy.

Personally I think our government is even worse then pretending nothing bad is going to happen. They're only doing what they are doing because of public pressure.
Some of the measures they've introduced are just stupid. No gatherings over 500 people, but schools with over 1,000 students can stay open? Universities...you name it.
It doesn't make sense, and that's because they have no plan, they are making it up as they go along.

Meanwhile what we will see is more and more businesses closing down voluntarily. Ernst & Young from tomorrow. Nike stores across Australia are closing as well.

The NBA, an entity worth tens of billions, has called it's season off. But our AFL here is looking at keeping the season going.
The advise is to limit contact with people, social distancing of 1.5m minimum. But the idiots running the AFL (who are giving the government a real good run for their money on the biggest idiots in Australia), think it'd be a good idea to increase the frequency of games over a shorter time period. :wallbash:

In Italy if you are a confirmed case that should be in isolation, and are caught out, you are going to be sent to jail on charges of homicide. That's how seriously they are now taking it in Italy.

Why is our government waiting to take the drastic measures needed?

Schools, universities, public transport, all sporting codes, everything needs to be shut down.
Shopping centres and super markets as well, it should only be online deliveries. But what has Coles gone and done, of course after they've reaped in hundreds of millions in extra profits now, they've cancelled all regular online deliveries except to the "vulnerable and remote"....so that forces everyone else to go into the stores. What happened to social distancing?

Are they going to take it seriously when thousands are infected or hundreds dead? Too late then.

The drastic measures & restrictions work. They're already seeing a positive change in the first "red zones" in Italy.

France has also said that all bills and even rental payments will be suspended for the time being. I think in Italy as well even mortgage repayments have been suspended.

Will the same be done for Australians?

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Re: Beer Garden

#3069 Post by rev » Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:43 am

Australia has 401 cases now. +101. 5 deaths.
Greece has 352 cases now. +21. 4 deaths.

Greece is going into a general lockdown tomorrow.
Schools and even playgrounds have been closed since around last week. None of this 1m distancing there either, it's 2m minimum.

They saw what was happening in Italy, and quickly took measures. A lot quicker then Australia moved it's ass into gear, with China on our doorstep.

Denmark went into lockdown with about 500 cases. They're now at nearly double, 914. 4 deaths.


Australia? Nah, she'll be right mate.
Give it another week, we will be close to 1,000 cases if not more.

The self isolation of returning travellers. What a crock of shit. They should all be placed into quarantine and kept there by authorities.

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Re: Beer Garden

#3070 Post by Nort » Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:23 pm

rev wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:43 am
The self isolation of returning travellers. What a crock of shit. They should all be placed into quarantine and kept there by authorities.
Into what quarantine facilities?

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Re: Beer Garden

#3071 Post by HiTouch » Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:34 pm

450 now. It’s been updated.
rev wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 12:55 am
If the parklands are so important why dont they put it to a vote state wide? Or are they afraid the majority will back this hotel..

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Re: Beer Garden

#3072 Post by Ho Really » Tue Mar 17, 2020 1:48 pm

SRW wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:44 pm
Ho Really wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:05 pm
No the tourism will not take a long time to recover. If we manage this virus with the isolation it deserves we'll be back to normal soon by end of year. The Chinese although secretive early on, and perhaps slow in a reaction, with the help of their political system have enforced a lockdown that now is producing positive results. Europeans (as in the EU) on the otherhand with their care-free attitude have exacerbated the whole issue. Like too many cooks in the kitchen.
Which is precisely why it will take longer to recover.
Those affected by the bushfires will take a long time to recover or won't recover at all, but I see it more positively. As rev said they'll start with domestic travel first and this will happen by the end of year, as said. Inbound and outbound international tourism operators will be the hardest hit and will need government assistance to get up and running in the same timeframe. We don't know how confident overseas travellers will be but we can control what we can do here.
SRW wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:44 pm
Ho Really wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:05 pm
A recession yes, but not by government mismanagement. Bushfires and pandemics are not of the government's doing. Let's wait and see what the first part of the stimulus does and then wait for the second before you accuse anyone SRW.
You can be blind to it if you like, but the Coalition has done nothing to improve structural issues in the economy since they were first elected. It's not the whole story for why the economy is on the precipice, but it's certainly the precondition.
I would like to hear what structural reforms you would like to see taken.
SRW wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:44 pm
Ho Really wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:05 pm
As for social housing, for whom? Yes civic construction, hospitals and clinics, public transport, roads and highways, schools and investment in trades, etc. Give people jobs and incentives not social experiments that have failed.
What I mean by social housing is not the stigmatised viewed you seem to take but rather something like the National Rental Affordability Scheme that was part of the Rudd government's package and saw projects like Uno and Ergo get off the ground here. But there are also other valid formats to pursue.
Incentives fine but not the NRAS which is a failure. Direct payments (welfare) to those that need it most would be better. Yes SRW, I think other options are much better. Australia needs more and better infrastructure. This could be the time to do it.

Cheers
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Re: Beer Garden

#3073 Post by OlympusAnt » Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:18 pm

one thing of note - the rate of increase in new cases in Italy is reducing

could be down to a number of things, but we need another week of data to see how it develops
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Re: Beer Garden

#3074 Post by rev » Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:29 pm

Nort wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:23 pm
rev wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:43 am
The self isolation of returning travellers. What a crock of shit. They should all be placed into quarantine and kept there by authorities.
Into what quarantine facilities?
The army can setup temporary accommodation very quickly for disasters, they have the capacity and the resources to get it done. Why not use stadiums? Oh wait, that would require the government to actually LEAD and cancel all sporting events first.
How many ovals or horse racing tracks are out there? How many disused army bases? Many places they could throw up a perimeter fence, lights, tents/accommodation and house people.

How many of those atco/site huts are there around the country? Probably tens of thousands, they get used everywhere and there's many companies that hire them out.
There's thousands of those things already configured for accommodation as they are used for mining camp sites.

There's many options. It's just a shame we have idiots in government.
In fact I'd be really surprised if they didn't have plans for temporary quarantine facilities as part of their emergency plans for disaster response.

They're already considering bringing in army doctors & nurses to hospitals.

Speaking of hospitals, is the private health system part of the response to this virus?

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Re: Beer Garden

#3075 Post by Nort » Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:34 pm

rev wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:29 pm
Nort wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:23 pm
rev wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:43 am
The self isolation of returning travellers. What a crock of shit. They should all be placed into quarantine and kept there by authorities.
Into what quarantine facilities?
The army can setup temporary accommodation very quickly for disasters, they have the capacity and the resources to get it done. Why not use stadiums? Oh wait, that would require the government to actually LEAD and cancel all sporting events first.
How many ovals or horse racing tracks are out there? How many disused army bases? Many places they could throw up a perimeter fence, lights, tents/accommodation and house people.

How many of those atco/site huts are there around the country? Probably tens of thousands, they get used everywhere and there's many companies that hire them out.
There's thousands of those things already configured for accommodation as they are used for mining camp sites.

There's many options. It's just a shame we have idiots in government.
In fact I'd be really surprised if they didn't have plans for temporary quarantine facilities as part of their emergency plans for disaster response.

They're already considering bringing in army doctors & nurses to hospitals.

Speaking of hospitals, is the private health system part of the response to this virus?
Problem with quickly throwing up quarantine facilities that aren't well designed is that instead of one infected person isolated at home you could very quickly end up with an entire camps worth of infected people.

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