News & Discussion: CBD Retail

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The Scooter Guy
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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3226 Post by The Scooter Guy » Thu Dec 12, 2019 8:11 pm

Eurostar wrote:
Thu Dec 12, 2019 10:04 am
The Myer Centre should be knocked down and rebuilt with retail and eateries on ground level, London Tavern on second floor with balcony, then floors of offices/apartments/hotel rooms on levels above.

If Big W did move into mall it should be a combined Woolworths , Big W store. I remember a restaurant used to be in basement before the previous upgrade maybe this time it should be on ground or above the shop.

Rundle Mall has nice views of the hills, we should have alfresco dining and balconies in the mall to take advantage of that especially at night time.
I wouldn't be surprised if Bunnings were to move from Kent Town into Rundle Mall (the current building is decades old).
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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3227 Post by ml69 » Thu Dec 12, 2019 9:08 pm

The Scooter Guy wrote:
Thu Dec 12, 2019 8:11 pm
Eurostar wrote:
Thu Dec 12, 2019 10:04 am
The Myer Centre should be knocked down and rebuilt with retail and eateries on ground level, London Tavern on second floor with balcony, then floors of offices/apartments/hotel rooms on levels above.

If Big W did move into mall it should be a combined Woolworths , Big W store. I remember a restaurant used to be in basement before the previous upgrade maybe this time it should be on ground or above the shop.

Rundle Mall has nice views of the hills, we should have alfresco dining and balconies in the mall to take advantage of that especially at night time.
I wouldn't be surprised if Bunnings were to move from Kent Town into Rundle Mall (the current building is decades old).
I’ll assume you are being tongue-in-cheek about Bunnings.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3228 Post by Jaymz » Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:12 am

Bulldoze the Myer centre did I read? Won't happen.A Singaporean investment consortium recently, well in the past couple of years, bought it for around $270 million. It's unfortunate though, because they were talking about turning it into some sort of shopping mecca, re-opening all the closed shops on the upper levels and filling it with high end brands. I was only in there last week and it looks pretty much the same as two years ago. Essentially if they bulldozed ir, theyve paid a couple hundred million bucks for a piece of land, plus construction of a new building.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3229 Post by SRW » Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:43 am

Yeah, you just don't demolish buildings that cost $1 billion to build...
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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3230 Post by Jaymz » Fri Dec 13, 2019 2:03 am

SRW wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:43 am
Yeah, you just don't demolish buildings that cost $1 billion to build...

Ummmm, yeah. But that's a whole 'nuther story 😆

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3231 Post by Mpol03 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:33 am

Demolish the entire CBD sans a couple of buildings and start again.

Lol. They will really need to internally restructure Myer Centre for it to work. And can they re clad the exterior? It’s as tired as fudge.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3232 Post by ml69 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 9:29 am

Mpol03 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:33 am
Demolish the entire CBD sans a couple of buildings and start again.

Lol. They will really need to internally restructure Myer Centre for it to work. And can they re clad the exterior? It’s as tired as fudge.
Exactly. Ground floor escalators to lower and upper levels need to be moved to the front entrance in front of Myer, not placed at the sides. Make it simple and easy for people to move up or down through the centre.

Adelaide Central Plaza (DJ’s building) does it quite well.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3233 Post by Patrick_27 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:05 am

Jaymz wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:12 am
Bulldoze the Myer centre did I read? Won't happen.A Singaporean investment consortium recently, well in the past couple of years, bought it for around $270 million. It's unfortunate though, because they were talking about turning it into some sort of shopping mecca, re-opening all the closed shops on the upper levels and filling it with high end brands. I was only in there last week and it looks pretty much the same as two years ago. Essentially if they bulldozed ir, theyve paid a couple hundred million bucks for a piece of land, plus construction of a new building.
I'm going to buy into the craziness of this idea for a moment, but if anyone were to bulldoze the Myer Centre, I could see it being a Singaporean or UAE investment consortium, let's not forget that these people have bucketloads of disposable income. If they paid that much for the centre and it's decreasing in value every year (which it would be the more it becomes vacant), then starting afresh might be the only crazy but logical option. Cost wise, $10-40m to bulldoze, $300-400m to rebuild. But if it's laid out correctly, it should make a good return on investment. Myer would come back, for starters, then you have high-end retailers who would pay a premium for a space, and then you have any high-rise component which whether it be commercial or hotel purposed, again the leasing rate would be standard but still profitable. Theoretically I'm not against the idea, and practically, it could be the best option. Think of what happened to the John Martin's building! - no one would have seen that happened even ten years before it happened, well at-least not to the extent that it did, the whole bloody building, but it happened!

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3234 Post by Nort » Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:52 am

Patrick_27 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:05 am
Jaymz wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:12 am
Bulldoze the Myer centre did I read? Won't happen.A Singaporean investment consortium recently, well in the past couple of years, bought it for around $270 million. It's unfortunate though, because they were talking about turning it into some sort of shopping mecca, re-opening all the closed shops on the upper levels and filling it with high end brands. I was only in there last week and it looks pretty much the same as two years ago. Essentially if they bulldozed ir, theyve paid a couple hundred million bucks for a piece of land, plus construction of a new building.
I'm going to buy into the craziness of this idea for a moment, but if anyone were to bulldoze the Myer Centre, I could see it being a Singaporean or UAE investment consortium, let's not forget that these people have bucketloads of disposable income. If they paid that much for the centre and it's decreasing in value every year (which it would be the more it becomes vacant), then starting afresh might be the only crazy but logical option. Cost wise, $10-40m to bulldoze, $300-400m to rebuild. But if it's laid out correctly, it should make a good return on investment. Myer would come back, for starters, then you have high-end retailers who would pay a premium for a space, and then you have any high-rise component which whether it be commercial or hotel purposed, again the leasing rate would be standard but still profitable. Theoretically I'm not against the idea, and practically, it could be the best option. Think of what happened to the John Martin's building! - no one would have seen that happened even ten years before it happened, well at-least not to the extent that it did, the whole bloody building, but it happened!
On the other hand, you could probably sell the site and buy land elsewhere in the CBD for cheaper.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3235 Post by SRW » Fri Dec 13, 2019 12:42 pm

Patrick_27 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:05 am
Cost wise, $10-40m to bulldoze, $300-400m to rebuild.
This is fanciful.

By way of comparison, the old RAH is costing $180-200 million to demolish. Admittedly, that includes remediation, but then again: the Myer Centre takes up an entire city block.

Not only is there zero logic to this suggestion, it is financially and environmentally irresponsible to entertain bulldozing a building so big, so expensive, and not even 30 years old. Especially when the situation is not so dire, and there are a multitude of other steps one might first take to improve it.
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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3236 Post by Patrick_27 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:16 pm

SRW wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 12:42 pm
Patrick_27 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:05 am
Cost wise, $10-40m to bulldoze, $300-400m to rebuild.
This is fanciful.

By way of comparison, the old RAH is costing $180-200 million to demolish. Admittedly, that includes remediation, but then again: the Myer Centre takes up an entire city block.

Not only is there zero logic to this suggestion, it is financially and environmentally irresponsible to entertain bulldozing a building so big, so expensive, and not even 30 years old. Especially when the situation is not so dire, and there are a multitude of other steps one might first take to improve it.
I don't disagree with you. As I said, merely buying into the craziness of it all for just a moment. Plus, what I should have also mentioned, wouldn't necessarily involve full demolition. You could gut the building down to a skeleton and redesign it, this would remove the exterior yellow cladding plus also allow for re- configuring the building. Frankly on the North Terrace frontage, it's quite a unique and beautiful building, the only thing that throws me is the colour of the cladding.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3237 Post by Patrick_27 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:18 pm

In other retail news, the new Rundle Street OTR will likely be open next week (almost entirely fit out).

The new Rundle Square KFC is complete and looks ready to open. Interestingly, it's not actually the corner tenancy but a smaller space. Looks like they've divided the old Telstra shop into two spaces.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3238 Post by how good is he » Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:41 pm

The other things to consider were the Singaporean owners, Starhill Global real estate investment trust, paid $288m for the Myer centre in 2015. The yield/return was 6.6% so about $20m per annum in rent back then. Based on its current size of 60,000 sqm of retail plus 10,000 sqm of offices the rebuild cost at say $5,000 sqm is $350m [although the original was rumoured to have cost $700m - $1b]. Also if the leases don't have re-development clauses the owner would have to buy them out. Myer is the main tenant, I think they would happily reduce their floor space but to go entirely for say 2-3 years would mean many millions of lost earnings. So payment of big compensation for this plus relocation costs etc
Just a random thought but would Myer may be happy to go and take over something the size of Harris Scarfe in Rundle Place?

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3239 Post by JAKJ » Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:19 pm

Patrick_27 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:16 pm
SRW wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 12:42 pm
Patrick_27 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:05 am
Cost wise, $10-40m to bulldoze, $300-400m to rebuild.
This is fanciful.

By way of comparison, the old RAH is costing $180-200 million to demolish. Admittedly, that includes remediation, but then again: the Myer Centre takes up an entire city block.

Not only is there zero logic to this suggestion, it is financially and environmentally irresponsible to entertain bulldozing a building so big, so expensive, and not even 30 years old. Especially when the situation is not so dire, and there are a multitude of other steps one might first take to improve it.
I don't disagree with you. As I said, merely buying into the craziness of it all for just a moment. Plus, what I should have also mentioned, wouldn't necessarily involve full demolition. You could gut the building down to a skeleton and redesign it, this would remove the exterior yellow cladding plus also allow for re- configuring the building. Frankly on the North Terrace frontage, it's quite a unique and beautiful building, the only thing that throws me is the colour of the cladding.
Correct me if I am wrong, but to keep the North Terrace facades some very expensive engineering was implemented as part of the build (part of the huge cost - beyond the rorting that occurred), is it even feasible to fully demolish this section without risking the North Terrace end? Would be great to see it gutted/ re-clad and substantially redesigned but would not want to lose the current North Terrace facade.

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Re: News & Discussion: CBD Retail

#3240 Post by Patrick_27 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:32 pm

how good is he wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:41 pm
The other things to consider were the Singaporean owners, Starhill Global real estate investment trust, paid $288m for the Myer centre in 2015. The yield/return was 6.6% so about $20m per annum in rent back then. Based on its current size of 60,000 sqm of retail plus 10,000 sqm of offices the rebuild cost at say $5,000 sqm is $350m [although the original was rumoured to have cost $700m - $1b]. Also if the leases don't have re-development clauses the owner would have to buy them out. Myer is the main tenant, I think they would happily reduce their floor space but to go entirely for say 2-3 years would mean many millions of lost earnings. So payment of big compensation for this plus relocation costs etc
Just a random thought but would Myer may be happy to go and take over something the size of Harris Scarfe in Rundle Place?
When the Myer Centre was built in '89/'90. Myer relocated to two city locations, one was in the space that Target now occupies, the other was the Austral Stores building on Hindley Street (if I recall rightly).

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