News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

[skyliner]

Agree entirely with Nathan. Many stations seem here seem user unfriendly. Most of Brisbane's stations are manned with an office. (many with toilets). A number of the Pt line stations here are very poor - glorified bus stops being a complimentary phrase to use. Would be better to reduce number of stops and make better stations of the rest - especially in weather protection.

ADELAIDE - TOWARDS A GREATER CITY SKYLINE[/b]

[SRW]

Bus stops in at least the city centre should be of a higher standard - these are some of the most patronised stops in the network, and yet many lack shelter or even benches.

[crawf]

With such poor train stations, how the heck did Adelaide's trains come 2nd best in AU?? Also with regular strikes, very slow trains, useless hourly/half hourly service frequencies, stalled electrification/upgrade works, hardly any staff, and worst rail patronage in AU.

Do you normally catch the train or do you just go by what's reported in the newspapers? I catch the train almost every day to and from the city, and while the frequency at night can be better, the overall service is great.

Whenever I go to Melbourne I am just shocked how there can be so much uncleaned graffiti all over the trains, it's disgraceful.

Brisbane and Sydney's trains are just about as slow as our Diesel trains, and Perth is of course the top.

Sorry Norman, but I have to completely disagree with you on this one. I have used all the interstate networks (except Perth) and Adelaide's network is by far the worst. Up until April this year, I used to catch the train daily into the city for work and I have lost count of the amount of times trains were dangerously overcrowded, late or cancelled due to "technical" issues. For example, quite a few times I boarded a full 3/4 car express Gawler Central Line service only to be cancelled and then told to get off the train and then race to the general Gawler Line 2-car service on another platform..... which is already packed to the max. Or wait 15 minutes for the next service which again will be completely full.

Another classic was when a service would get cancelled or delayed without any communication. And when they did announce it over the PA, you could hardly hear the PA due to the loud diesel engines. Speaking of PA, why have they change the station announcements inside the train?. The male voice sounds amateur and slightly awkward.

So from my own personal experience, I am honestly surprised with this survey. I love this city, but I absolutely loath our train network and believes it deserves no praise compared to other cities. I lived in Mawson Lakes at the time so perhaps it's better along the Seaford Line, but to be near the end of 2016 and still have hour frequency at night aswell as the shocking state of most of our "stations" I believe is utterly disgraceful.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, this Government needs to get on with completing the entire electrification and upgrade of the train network before embarking on further tramline extensions. It's soon going to be a decade since Mike Rann announcement the electrification project!

[Norman]

I do live on the Seaford line, so I guess it is a bit different to someone using the Gawler line. The particular train I catch everyday is on time to the minute 99% of the time and has never been cancelled. Apart from the electricity switch fault a few months back, I've always been able to jump on with no issues.

In terms of crowding, people do stand, but it only gets bad during the show.

I agree that we need to do a lot more work on our stations, a lot of them haven't been touched for decades. But hopefully new housing developments and increasing density will fix that. I think we have a great opportunity to make big improvements. Firstly they need to electrify Gawler, Outer Harbor, Grange and Belair lines in that order. Because I am more familiar with the southern lines, here's my wish list for the southern lines.

Seaford Line:
- Grade separate all rail crossings between Adelaide and Brighton
- Install City Loop ($?)
- Upgrade Mile End with fresh platforms and improved underpass to the same standard as Marion Station ($5-10m)
- Refresh platform surface at Goodwood Station along with the new overpass. ($12m)
- Rail trench from Goodwood underpass to Edwardstown station ($300m)
- New station at Clarence Park with grade separation, same standard as Springvale (Melbourne)
- New station at Emerson with grade separation, same standard as Springvale (Melbourne)
- New station between Edwardstown and Woodlands Park, both stations to be demolished and track realigned to increase speed. New station to be the same standard as Adelaide Showground. ($15m)
- New station at Oaklands with grade separation, Warradale to be scrapped. Install ticket barriers and kiosk. ($150m)
- New station at Hove with grade separation, same standard as Springvale (Melbourne) ($150m)
- Refresh Brighton Station. Install ticket barriers. ($3m)
- Close Marino Rocks and realign track ($0.5m)
- Cover roof at Hallet Cove and Hallet Cove Beach. Install ticket barriers and kiosk at Hallet Cove Beach. ($3m)
- Refresh Noarlunga Station and install ticket barriers ($5m)
- Install ticket machines at all stations and staff Oaklands, Brighton, Hallett Cove Beach, Noarlunga Centre and Seaford during peak
- Increase frequency to 30 minutes at night

Tonsley Line
- Rebuild Clovelly Park station to integrate with new Tonsley housing development, same standard as St. Clair ($5m)
- Extend line to Flinders Medical Centre, new station to be same standard as Adelaide Showground. Install ticket barriers. Install small kiosk.

[Llessur2002]

The particular train I catch everyday is on time to the minute 99% of the time and has never been cancelled. I've always been able to jump on with no issues.

Same experience for me on the Outer harbor line. To be fair though, I do often notice how much more crowded the Gawler trains are when I walk past one at the station. Hopefully the higher capacity trains should alleviate some of this when the line is electrified in 2017/18 (fingers crossed).

[claybro]

- New station between Edwardstown and Woodlands Park, both stations to be demolished and track realigned to increase speed. New station to be the same standard as Adelaide Showground. ($15m)- New station at Oaklands with grade separation, Warradale to be scrapped. Install ticket barriers and kiosk. ($150m)- New station at Hove with grade separation, same standard as Springvale (Melbourne) ($150m

Do like these suggestions for Seaford line. Closure of Edwardstown and Woodlands with a new station in between is a no brainer. The new station should have good pedestrian connection to Castle Plaza.
Also like the rail trench idea for removing level crossings, as there is mutiny in some Melbourne suburbs due to sections of elevated rail being extended to remove level crossings. 24 hour trains and elevated lines would prove a nightmare for some residents.
Another candidate for station consolidation should be Woodville/Woodville Park on the OH-ridiculously close together. And as it is some time since I used to travel that line, is Cheltenham still open given it is so close to St Claire and in the middle of a very low density suburb? If it is ,Cheltenham should be closed.

[muzzamo]

I still think that something needs to be done about the connection between tram and train at goodwood - it has so much potential.

Hoping out of the current tender process for the upgrade to the bikeway overpass they come to their senses and build a tram stop above the station.

[[Shuz]]

- New station between Edwardstown and Woodlands Park, both stations to be demolished and track realigned to increase speed. New station to be the same standard as Adelaide Showground. ($15m)- New station at Oaklands with grade separation, Warradale to be scrapped. Install ticket barriers and kiosk. ($150m)- New station at Hove with grade separation, same standard as Springvale (Melbourne) ($150m

Do like these suggestions for Seaford line. Closure of Edwardstown and Woodlands with a new station in between is a no brainer. The new station should have good pedestrian connection to Castle Plaza.

Also like the rail trench idea for removing level crossings, as there is mutiny in some Melbourne suburbs due to sections of elevated rail being extended to remove level crossings. 24 hour trains and elevated lines would prove a nightmare for some residents.

Another candidate for station consolidation should be Woodville/Woodville Park on the OH-ridiculously close together. And as it is some time since I used to travel that line, is Cheltenham still open given it is so close to St Claire and in the middle of a very low density suburb? If it is ,Cheltenham should be closed.

Trench is most likely solution to removing level crossings at Emerson, Delaine Ave and Angus Avenue - kill three crossings in one go. If new station is built between Woodlands and Edwardstown, it would probably be elevated over Raglan Avenue, given space constraints of corridor and minimal disruption to traffic. Sixth and Dunorlan intersection best as a trench given close proximity to Ascot Park and being predominately residential areas. Daws should be a half-half job - quick turnaround in construction minimising rail and road traffic impact by taking advantage of backfill construction method - one span rail bridge done over a weekend closure.

[PD2/20]

I still think that something needs to be done about the connection between tram and train at goodwood - it has so much potential.

Hoping out of the current tender process for the upgrade to the bikeway overpass they come to their senses and build a tram stop above the station.

Is the potential of a tram stop so great? The main interchange flow would be train south/tram city which would provide improved access to southern CBD. But would it give improved journey times to central CBD, as it involves a change and a slower tram leg. Again putting a tram stop at the station would presumably involve closing the existing Goodwood Rd and Forestville stops which are more conveniently located for the present local traffic.

The design of the tram stop would be a considerable challenge. Would it be centre or side platform? Where would the stair and lift access be located to provide rail interchange and local access? How would it interact with the bikeway overpass? And there is the further problem that the new Brownhill Ck culvert runs through the area.

[rhino]

The design of the tram stop would be a considerable challenge. Would it be centre or side platform? Where would the stair and lift access be located to provide rail interchange and local access? How would it interact with the bikeway overpass? And there is the further problem that the new Brownhill Ck culvert runs through the area.

These are not questions to be asked at this stage - they are things to sort out once the idea has been tabled and it has been agreed that it would be beneficial. If people had to have all the issues sorted out before anything could be tabled, nothing would get done. Having said that, yes, these are the issues. They are all surmountable.

[claybro]

this is a conundrum that has come up a few times here. Is it worth closing the relatively busy Goodwood road tram stop, adjacent to the pub, shops, cafes and bus routes on Goodwood road, in order to provide an interchange at goodwwod station, which is poorly located by comparison, and relatively poorly patronised? Despite its position, at the junction leading to the 3 southern lines, goodwwod station really is not that busy and serves no commercial precinct directly being out of sight of the Goodwood village and a bit far of a walk. The loss of the goodwwod road tram stop would be a huge inconvenience.

[Patrick_27]

Having lived for some years (in the past) wedged between the Seaford line and Glenelg line, and used both regularly before; I echo Norms wish-list. I expect there will be some kind of grade separation at Emerson when they rejig that part of South Road.

Though, rather than ticket barriers... The cheaper and simpler option would be for tap-on posts and ticketing machines outside of the platform, similar to Melbourne's minor metro stations. Remove the ticketing/tap-on machines from trains and police the trains, then there is literally no excuse for fare evasion. I don't think we should make a habit of profiteering excessively from people breaking the rules (like they do in Victoria) but if we're losing money on fare evasion, and other offences (such as vandalism); recoup those loses from fining those that are caught in the wrong. Our bus network is seemingly becoming more policed by inspectors, unfortunately though they seem to want to only target bus routes running to and from the suburban university campuses, probably why they let off a lot of people they catch in the wrong. And to be expected, the tram line is still a fare evasion paradise. I tell you what, fining evaders would fund these station upgrades...

[monotonehell]

...Though, rather than ticket barriers... The cheaper and simpler option would be for tap-on posts and ticketing machines outside of the platform, similar to Melbourne's minor metro stations. Remove the ticketing/tap-on machines from trains and police the trains, then there is literally no excuse for fare evasion. I don't think we should make a habit of profiteering excessively from people breaking the rules (like they do in Victoria) but if we're losing money on fare evasion, and other offences (such as vandalism); recoup those loses from fining those that are caught in the wrong. Our bus network is seemingly becoming more policed by inspectors, unfortunately though they seem to want to only target bus routes running to and from the suburban university campuses, probably why they let off a lot of people they catch in the wrong. And to be expected, the tram line is still a fare evasion paradise. I tell you what, fining evaders would fund these station upgrades...

Please leave tap-on terminals on the vehicles, and have tap-on terminals at stops. Best of both worlds:
If one s faulty, you're unfamiliar with the system, or you're running to board a train, there's a backup. Also many stations wouldn't lend themselves to barriers, and the installation of terminals could be done progressively, so we would need that flexibility. The tap-on terminals on the platforms would be a time saver during peak for quicker boarding.

While there is no excuse for actual fare evasion, there are situations where people get caught out trying to do the right thing that looks like fare evasion. Melbourne have realised that their zero tolerance fare-nazis were a bad idea, and have softened the rules. For example, tourists jump on a traim (I'm coining a new word, portmanteau of tram/train ) with credit card in hand, but the ticket machine is not working. I've seen this happen a few times. Or they rock up with a $5 note, the machine only takes coins.

These ideas sound attractive, but the devil is in implementation. You end up creating a near unworkable system (like Melbourne recently did).

[PD2/20]

Though, rather than ticket barriers... The cheaper and simpler option would be for tap-on posts and ticketing machines outside of the platform, similar to Melbourne's minor metro stations. Remove the ticketing/tap-on machines from trains and police the trains, then there is literally no excuse for fare evasion. I don't think we should make a habit of profiteering excessively from people breaking the rules (like they do in Victoria) but if we're losing money on fare evasion, and other offences (such as vandalism); recoup those loses from fining those that are caught in the wrong. Our bus network is seemingly becoming more policed by inspectors, unfortunately though they seem to want to only target bus routes running to and from the suburban university campuses, probably why they let off a lot of people they catch in the wrong. And to be expected, the tram line is still a fare evasion paradise. I tell you what, fining evaders would fund these station upgrades...

Other advantages of ticketing machines and tap-on on trains/trams are that the machines can be be serviced easily without having staff travel to remote locations and that the machines are in a friendlier environment (no weather, less vandalism and theft).

[[Shuz]]

Also major flaw of Melbourne's myki, is that you have to have a positive balance in order to get a pass and the passes double up. So, say you have $2.90 credit, you touch on for a trip that's $3.90, thus -$1.00 in the negative when you touch off (the screens don't tell you you're in the balance when you touch off), you completely forget about it, next day touch on, only to get declined. Top up with pass $39.00, but still get declined, so you have to top up another $1.00 to get back into a positive balance, only for the $3.90 to then be deducted again as well as the pass, because it recognizes that you touched on even though it was declined.