News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

Threads relating to transport, water, etc. within the CBD and Metropolitan area.
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Will409
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#46 Post by Will409 » Fri Apr 20, 2007 5:14 pm

One would assume that the Port Adelaide silo facility will remain open or is it set to close as well?

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Time for an upgrade to the city's rail system

#47 Post by littledyl16 » Mon Apr 23, 2007 12:16 pm

Our rail system is due for an overhaul, Adelaide needed to go electric a few years ago, when other capital cities did, plus we probably have the oldest fleet of trains. Some stations have been due for an upgrade years ago. The salisbury train station is so unsafe, at night time there are drunks and ferals there, there needs to be security personnel there.

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#48 Post by jimmy_2486 » Mon Apr 23, 2007 8:50 pm

I cant agree with you more...

I use the Noarlunga train every day just about and it looking so dingy now. When I went to Sydney I hopped on the new millennium train and they blew me away!!

On top of that people are saying Sydney's trains are crap compared to hong kong , NY, Singapore etc, so imagine what the world would think of OUR network!!!

And don't get me started on the Gawler line as I get scared, people drinking on it all the time, 15 year old pregnant mothers, its getting real baad!!!

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#49 Post by AG » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:20 pm

Firstly, let me say, there is already a thread for this stuff so please use the existing threads. We don't need hundreds of new threads repeating what is already covered in existing threads.

Okay, now there are a few things that should be mentioned.

You'll find that a lot of suburban railway stations in suburbs all over Australia are not safe at night time. I know that in recent years numerous incidents have occurred at stations on Brisbane's southside, notably on the Beenleigh line. Sydney, even with far more passengers, has some stations that aren't exactly safe at night, particularly in the southwestern areas. Perth is probably the city really showing a lead in trying to make its railway stations more secure.

Some stations around the Adelaide rail network have been upgraded recently, but this has mostly been only by providing new audio timetable info, new station signage and wheelchair accessibility. In a couple of cases platforms have been extended to accomodate longer trains, but this is where the upgrading has really ended.

I'm yet to see anything as bad as a fire damaged railcar yet, there are many of those that have gone to the trash heap in Sydney and Melbourne.

Sydney's rail system woes come from several fronts. Many of the trains (some of the R and S sets which make up a fair portion of the fleet) do not have air conditioning. Adelaide's entire fleet does have air conditioning, and the oldest railcars are still around 10 years younger than Sydney's oldest. There are hundreds of trains in Sydney's fleet. Most are more than 20 years old. The new Millennium trains only make up 35 of the fleet, and are the only new suburban trains along with the 2 or 3 new Oscar sets running around Sydney younger than 10 years. Having said that, the Millennium trains only operate on some lines (Sector 2).

The other problem Sydney has is that some rail corridors are congested. This is one of the main causes of delays across the rail network. The most notably congested corridor is the Strathfield to Redfern corridor in inner western Sydney where many lines converge on only 6 tracks. Also the City Circle. There is not much consistancy with the stopping patterns of trains on some lines - some fast services get caught behind slow services at times. Strathfield to Central is still quite a fast trip though by the Western or Northern Lines, as they don't stop anywhere usually between Strathfield and Redfern. Sydney's attempt at solving these issues is with a rail program called Clearways, which involves building numerous turnbacks, new terminating platforms and new tracks.

Hong Kong's MTR is one of the best models of efficiency. It isn't fair to compare it to CityRail though, as the rail networks are designed very differently and to a different model from a suburban rail system. Hong Kong cleverly seperates the operation of every line, and provides cross platform interchanges to maximise traffic flow across the network.

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#50 Post by rev » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:52 pm

Trust me, sticking security guards at train stations wont make them safer.
Just ask the security guards who are unfourunate enough to get the late shift at west tce maccas.

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#51 Post by Will409 » Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:10 am

I live on the Gawler Central line and I have seen more then my fair share of drunks, derros and general rat bags on the train. It isn't as bad as most people think but it is still bad. I have had ballast thrown at me at Greenfields (one piece hit me and I now have as small dent in the side of my head), I have been at Elizabeth and have had a stoned aboriginal come up to me asking for my name, I told him I had none but he kept on calling me Andrew for some reason! I noticed he was carrying a bag of drugs in his other hand as well making no effort to hide it.

However, my issue with the Gawler Central line is not the occasional run in with a derro but the appaling state of the track. Here are a few photos of the track at Greenfields. The last one is the ARTC mainline also at Greenfields which is identical to the Sydney system (which I had the joy of riding on in January).

http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2317
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2319
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2321
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2323
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2323
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2325
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2325
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2327
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2329
http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2331
TransAdelaide

http://www.railsa.com/f/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=2314
ARTC (although CityRail is the same)

What makes those photos all the more frightening is that there is a once daily 2500t broad gauge limestone train from the Barossa that has to pass over that!

The Gawler Central line does have a lot of potential to become by far the fastest service in Adelaide because for many kms, the track is dead straight and what curves there are, are not all too sharp. There are numerous TSRs which are slowing down services badly down to 15km/h. The ride quality is awful to say the least. If all TSRs were removed and the track upgraded to Outer Harbour line standard, about 5-10minutes could be shaved from the timetable. If those photos are not a sign of a system in decay, what is?

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#52 Post by crawf » Mon May 28, 2007 1:07 am

woohoo, about bloody time

Budget first step to electric trains
MICHAEL OWEN, POLITICAL REPORTER

May 28, 2007 02:15am
Article from: The Advertiser

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ADELAIDE'S ailing rail system will get funding for a major upgrade in next week's State Budget as part of the first step toward electrifying the network.

(Do you have a public transport horror story? If so, AdelaideNow would like to hear from you. Scroll down and tell us all about it in the feedback box below.)

In another sign that infrastructure spending is the Government's key Budget priority, improvements such as rail track and signalling upgrades are understood to have been allocated significant amounts.

This will stem pressure on the Government to curb problems with overcrowded and late trains, while starting the overhaul of Adelaide's outdated diesel-powered network.

It is understood the Government has decided to focus on upgrading the rail network rather than commit to further extensions of the Adelaide-Glenelg tram line.

This rail upgrade initially will concentrate on improving existing lines rather than creating new links or buying new trains.

Treasurer Kevin Foley yesterday refused to comment on measures in the June 7 Budget but Opposition Leader Martin Hamilton-Smith said moves to electrify Adelaide's rail network were long overdue.

An electric network is considered more reliable, less noisy and more environmentally friendly. It has been estimated electrifying Adelaide's train network would cost between $235 million and $500 million.

But Railway Technical Society of Australasia vice chairman Martin Baggott yesterday said track and signal upgrades were vital first steps in any move toward electrification.

"The fundamental thing is to upgrade the track, which really means making it suitable to be able to take trains that inevitably are going to accelerate and brake faster and probably travel at faster speeds," he said. "The other portion of the network is the signalling system. With an electric system the signalling needs to be constructed so that it is suitable with all the electric currents."

Other considerations, such as adequate overhead space in rail corridors to take the increased height of electric railcars, could be done at the same time as any track upgrade, he said.

"One thing they would be doing when upgrading the track would be making sure the bridge clearances were adequate, and also the overhead and sideways clearances," Mr Baggott said.

Existing rail cars, some of which are almost 30 years old, are considered unsuitable for conversion, meaning new rolling stock would be required.

A December, 2004, Transport Department report obtained by The Advertiser in March ruled out expanding Adelaide's existing diesel rail service because it was considered unattractive to passengers and would not be cost-effective.

In April, TransAdelaide general manager Bill Watson said a full electric upgrade of the fleet would significantly reduce the number and rate of mechanical failures.

Mr Hamilton-Smith last night said any Government spending on rail infrastructure, with a view to electrification of the network, would be fully backed by the Liberal Party. But he demanded further details, including which sections of rail track would be electrified and whether the Outer Harbor line was still being considered for a tram extension.

Mr Hamilton-Smith said Adelaide's outdated train system was a "national joke".

"We are the only diesel train system left and if the Government is going to do something in this Budget then, great. It is just a shame it has taken them six Budgets to make a start," he said.

A spokeswoman for Mr Foley last night said: "The Government won't comment on details in the Budget until it is handed down on June 7."

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#53 Post by jimmy_2486 » Mon May 28, 2007 1:38 am

THANK BLOODY GOD!!!!

now i can catch the train without the need to throw up cos I hate the state of our trains!!!!

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#54 Post by AtD » Mon May 28, 2007 7:19 am

I'm a bit more sceptical. After all, the first proposal to electrify Adelaide's rail network is over 100 years old! It's just talk now, I'll believe it when I see it.

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#55 Post by bdm » Mon May 28, 2007 10:26 am

All they need to do is find the 1962 MATS plan for public transport and copy it, and tada--they'll be alright.

35 years late.

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#56 Post by Howie » Mon May 28, 2007 10:44 am

Hope they're serious about it.
It has been estimated electrifying Adelaide's train network would cost between $235 million and $500 million.
While not insignificant, that's not an entirely absurd amount of money to spend on something as important and rail. If they get this done on time and on budget, they've got my vote for the next state election.

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#57 Post by crawf » Mon May 28, 2007 11:09 am

Majority of Adelaidian's are fed up with the train system, and I think if this government doesn't decide to do it (which i bloody hope they do) the opposition will use it as a key election promise.

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#58 Post by jimmy_2486 » Mon May 28, 2007 3:29 pm

bdm wrote:All they need to do is find the 1962 MATS plan for public transport and copy it, and tada--they'll be alright.
Can you provide a link to this as I want to see this plan.

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#59 Post by Howie » Mon May 28, 2007 3:34 pm


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#60 Post by bdm » Mon May 28, 2007 5:21 pm

That's the freeway part of it. It doesn't mention the rail upgrades, grade separations, KWS subway, electrification, etc.

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