News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

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Waewick
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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#256 Post by Waewick » Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:33 pm

PeFe wrote:March 2019 (?)
Lets hope the both parties are in agreement in NSW that there is benefit to NSW!

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#257 Post by SBD » Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:27 pm

Waewick wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:33 pm
PeFe wrote:March 2019 (?)
Lets hope the both parties are in agreement in NSW that there is benefit to NSW!
That would only take one summer load-shedding event in NSW while the wind is blowing and the sun is shining in SA, but the Victoria-NSW interconnector is running at capacity.

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#258 Post by Goodsy » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:18 pm

https://www.sawater.com.au/news/solar-t ... er-savings
Solar to generate water savings

SA Water is looking to install 152 megawatts of solar photo-voltaic generation and 35 megawatt hours of energy storage over the next two years, to realise its ambitious goal of achieving zero net electricity costs by 2020.

Distributing generation and storage capacity across approximately 70 of its sites around the state is forecast to reduce SA Water’s electricity operating costs and deliver new revenue, to achieve the zero net outcome.

SA Water Chief Executive Roch Cheroux said neutralising the company’s electricity costs – which reached $55 million for 220 gigawatt hours in 2016-17 – will produce an operational saving to be passed on to customers in keeping with the objectives of the independent regulatory process.

“We’re working hard to keep our customers’ water prices as low and stable as possible, and big operational circuit breakers like this are essential to achieving savings and future price reductions,” said Roch.

“Locating generation behind the meter will improve our resilience to grid interruptions, significantly reduce our network charges and isolate our business from electricity market price volatility, in both the short and long-term.

“The maturity of solar technology has allowed us to confidently determine how and where it can assume supply for our energy-intensive water treatment and pumping operations, and export to the market to return revenue.”

An independent review of the deployment plan and economic assumptions has confirmed its feasibility, with benefits to be realised incrementally from the start of installation.

Energising the solar arrays will be SA Water’s first focus, with the selection and acquisition of storage to be informed by a series of thermal, flywheel and battery trials currently being progressed with specialist technology partners.

“We’re now looking to hear from experienced and capable suppliers who can help deliver arrays ranging in size from 100 kilowatts to 13 megawatts, at metropolitan and regional locations.”

An initial Expression of Interest with guidance for prospective vendors is now available through tenders.sa.gov.au.

"Our range of energy initiatives like biogas and hydroelectric generation, and trading as a market participant, has cut more than $3 million a year from our electricity bills since 2013,” said Roch.

“Scaling-up our solar capacity will jolt our energy management program towards our goal of zero net electricity costs by 2020.”

SA Water’s solar portfolio began taking shape with the installation of a pilot 100 kilowatt solar photo-voltaic and 50 kilowatt hour battery storage system at its Crystal Brook Depot.

A further $10 million investment in up to six megawatts of solar photo-voltaic panels to be positioned at treatment facilities in metropolitan Adelaide was announced in December 2017, with first installation on-track to start at Christies Beach Wastewater Treatment Plant next month.

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#259 Post by 1NEEDS2POST » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:09 pm

Is SA Water's energy storage going to be pumped hydro or something else?

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#260 Post by PeFe » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:28 pm

More detail on Sanjeev Gupta's plans
Sanjeev Gupta steps up $1.37b renewable energy build near Whyalla steelworks

Image

British billionaire Sanjeev Gupta expects to begin construction of the Cultana solar energy project which encompasses 780,000 solar panels near the revived Whyalla steelworks early in 2019 as part of a broader $1.37 billion investment into renewable energy projects in the Spencer Gulf region in South Australia.

Mr Gupta, the executive chairman of GFG Alliance, outlined on Wednesday fresh details of his renewable energy investment plans for the Whyalla region, with the 280-megawatt Cultana Solar Project the centrepiece of a $US1 billion investment program by his majority-owned renewables company SIMEC ZEN Energy. The plans also include a separate co-generation plant at the steelworks using waste gas, and pumped hydro projects at the nearby Middleback Range mining operations that supply feedstock to the steelworks.

Full article : https://www.afr.com/business/energy/ele ... 814-h13zcc
And the Guardian Australia's story

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... aper-power

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#261 Post by PeFe » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:19 pm

And now more detail on the proposed battery at the Lake Bonney wind farm.
From In Daily
Another big battery to be built in SA
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Infigen announced today that construction of the 25MW/52MWh battery – using Tesla Powerpack technology – would begin within weeks.

The $38 million facility is backed by $5 million from the State Government, provided through the renewable technology fund set up by the previous administration, and $5 million from the Federal Government’s renewable energy agency, ARENA.

Infigen said the facility will be connected to the national electricity grid via the Mayurra substation and would provide “firming” services (allowing energy to be guaranteed for a committed time), as well as system security and ancillary services.

Full article : https://indaily.com.au/news/2018/08/15/ ... ilt-in-sa/

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#262 Post by JimmyBowden » Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:42 pm

One more detail about infigen in South Australia, it seems like examined alternative option to firm up intermittent wind generation. Visit these related news website, you will find additional information regarding that...
https://www.afr.com/technology/infigen- ... 815-h13znd
https://www.afr.com/street-talk/what-ab ... 815-h14182
https://magesolar.com/best-solar-briefcase
https://www.energymatters.com.au/renewa ... y-storage/

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#263 Post by Spurdo » Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:04 pm

Have been a bit slack with these updates, but here is the latest energy proposals under consideration.

Seaford Heights Landfill Gas Plant (~3MW)
https://www.saplanningcommission.sa.gov ... n_Vale.pdf

Terregra Murray Bridge Solar Farm (4.9MW)
https://www.saplanningcommission.sa.gov ... 012-18.pdf

Also found this development application on the DAPR
Application Number: 830/V001/18
Lodged: 03/08/2018
Location: Boundary Track, Baroota Reservoir, Baroota; and Cattle Track and Baroota Road, Baroota
Description: Baroota Pumped Hydro and Solar Project comprising (a) Pumped Hydro: provide up to 270MW of grid connected power (storage <8hrs), consisting of an upper and lower storage connected by 1.2km water pipeline, including powerhouse building, switch yard / substation, ancillary equipment and civil/bulk earthworks; (b) Solar Farm: provide up to 300MW of solar pv generation capacity (single axis tracking arrays), internal access tracks, operational facilities, inverters, substation and ancillary works. Development will connect to local 275kV transmission line.
Status: Under Assessment
Rumour is that the former Angas Zinc Mine in the Adelaide Hills is going to be converted into a Compressed Air Energy Storage Facility (https://www.austrade.gov.au/internation ... ian-market)

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#264 Post by PeFe » Fri Aug 24, 2018 11:16 am

Adani solar farm at Whyalla looks like going ahead.

From Renew Economy
Adani set to build Whyalla solar farm, as it finalises supply contracts

Work is set to begin on a 140MW solar farm being built north of Whyalla in South Australia by the renewables arm of Indian energy giant Adani, after the company received the final green light for the project.

Adani – whose name is more often associated in Australia with its controversial plans to develop the nation’s largest coal mine in Queensland’s Galilee Basin – said on Thursday it had won pre-construction approval to go ahead with the solar farm north of Whyalla.

The $200 million project is expected to generate 100MW, with a potential capacity of 140MW, and the option to add battery storage.

Full article : https://reneweconomy.com.au/adani-set-t ... cts-50865/

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#265 Post by PeFe » Sun Sep 09, 2018 11:47 pm

Sonnen look like they are about to start building their battery manufacturing plant at the Holden site in Elizabeth.

From Renew Economy
Sonnen to manufacture home batteries at old Holden factory in Adelaide

German battery storage giant Sonnen has announced plans to manufacture up to 10,000 battery storage units a year at the old Holden car manufacturing site in Adelaide, confirming that there is a future for manufacturing in a state with high renewables.

The announcement by Sonnen came just a day after the South Australia Liberal government unveiled the details of its $100 million Home Battery Scheme, a subsidy of up to $6,000 per household that will be supported by a further $100 million in finance from the Clean Energy Finance Corporation.

Sonnen founder and CEO Christoph Ostermann told RenewEconomy in an interview on Sunday that the production facility should be up and running with two months, given the preparations that have been made since sonnen first proposed an Adelaide manufacturing base with the previous Labor government.

Full article : https://reneweconomy.com.au/sonnen-to-m ... ide-92563/

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#266 Post by Nort » Mon Sep 10, 2018 9:04 am

Kudos to the Liberals for going ahead with this. There are some specific parts of the plan (like it not being obligatory for those participating in the scheme to connect to the VPP) that seem iffy, but other parts like the incentives to manufacture locally are exactly what we need.

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#267 Post by PeFe » Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:56 pm

So the battery sudsidy is only applied to "South Australian manufactured" products?

Is this the incentive (or government handout) for Sonnen to setup in Adelaide?

Its a real tragedy that connection to a virtual power grid is not obligatory...
this could lead to a situation where thousands of batteries sit idle during heatwaves (despite the fact that the government has paid for the batteries....
handouts/subsidies for the middle class.)

I am in 2 minds about the battery subsidies....I prefer the Tesla/Housing Trust option where a virtual grid will be continually expanded with all the excess battery power returned to the electricity grid during heatwaves (this will happen even with a privately owned and operated entity, the business model will be "sell back to the grid when the spot electricity prices are high" ie heatwaves)

But this is all academic.....Sonnen are coming, hopefully its a big success so the SA government has the money and will to persue other storeage options (therefore decreasing the chance of blackouts)

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#268 Post by Waewick » Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:19 pm

PeFe wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:56 pm
So the battery sudsidy is only applied to "South Australian manufactured" products?

Is this the incentive (or government handout) for Sonnen to setup in Adelaide?

Its a real tragedy that connection to a virtual power grid is not obligatory...
this could lead to a situation where thousands of batteries sit idle during heatwaves (despite the fact that the government has paid for the batteries....
handouts/subsidies for the middle class.)

I am in 2 minds about the battery subsidies....I prefer the Tesla/Housing Trust option where a virtual grid will be continually expanded with all the excess battery power returned to the electricity grid during heatwaves (this will happen even with a privately owned and operated entity, the business model will be "sell back to the grid when the spot electricity prices are high" ie heatwaves)

But this is all academic.....Sonnen are coming, hopefully its a big success so the SA government has the money and will to persue other storeage options (therefore decreasing the chance of blackouts)
I think you will find the housing trust one goes ahead as well (or continues)

I am not in 2 minds at all about the customers being forced to sign up to the virtual power grid. Now I am aware that this is just another subsidy (it isn't just middle class handout, such a boring trope ) but the people buying it are still taking the risk and the ownership of the obsolete battery in x amount of years, they are perfectly in their right to use it how they chose.

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#269 Post by SBD » Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:47 pm

PeFe wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:56 pm
So the battery sudsidy is only applied to "South Australian manufactured" products?

Is this the incentive (or government handout) for Sonnen to setup in Adelaide?

Its a real tragedy that connection to a virtual power grid is not obligatory...
this could lead to a situation where thousands of batteries sit idle during heatwaves (despite the fact that the government has paid for the batteries....
handouts/subsidies for the middle class.)

I am in 2 minds about the battery subsidies....I prefer the Tesla/Housing Trust option where a virtual grid will be continually expanded with all the excess battery power returned to the electricity grid during heatwaves (this will happen even with a privately owned and operated entity, the business model will be "sell back to the grid when the spot electricity prices are high" ie heatwaves)

But this is all academic.....Sonnen are coming, hopefully its a big success so the SA government has the money and will to persue other storeage options (therefore decreasing the chance of blackouts)
It's not clear to me yet exactly what the business and "ownership" model is for a virtual grid. Presumably it is actually a real, physical grid (as in actual wires) connecting batteries (hardware) installed across the grid on private (predominantly residential) property.

If Andrew spends his own money to buy a battery, charges it from his own solar panels and uses it to power only his own house, then he might be a "selfish bastard", but he is still helping the rest of us by reducing the demand on the grid at peak times. He gets the most financial impact from this if he is charged a variable rate for the electricity he buys from the grid, so he can choose to use his battery at the times when the grid power price is highest.

If Bronwyn accepts all the available subsidies and does exactly the same, then the effect for the rest of us is the same too, except we paid up front to receive that effect.

If Charles is community-minded and joins into the virtual battery program, then who owns, benefits and controls what?
  • Does he get a feed-in tariff to charge the battery, or only when it discharges?
  • Does he choose the time and price to export and when he wants to keep the battery for his own use, or does the company control that?
  • Does he even see variable pricing, or is he charged/paid fixed rates regardless of the market around him?
  • Will the system be wired so it is possible for Charles to go off-grid and (same as Andrew and Bronwyn) choose to operate independently from the grid using only his own panels and battery?

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Re: News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

#270 Post by PeFe » Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:20 pm

Waewick wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:19 pm
Now I am aware that this is just another subsidy (it isn't just middle class handout, such a boring trope ) but the people buying it are still taking the risk and the ownership of the obsolete battery in x amount of years, they are perfectly in their right to use it how they chose.
Its $100 million dollars of tax payers money.......the people who "buy" the battery are being heavily subsidized....not much risk there. The initial grant will up to $6,000, the last time I saw battery prices (ie Tesla) the quotes were around $8,000-$10,000. If you only have to fork out 2K.......
the ownership of the obsolete battery in x amount of years, they are perfectly in their right to use it how they chose.
These batteries will probably last 20-30 years (if they are a quality product and since Sonnen is German, I am going to invoke the stereotype of "quality German product" cliche)

And Labor in Victoria is promising battery subsidies should it be re- elected in November.
Now that would make Sonnen very very happy.......

https://reneweconomy.com.au/victoria-go ... ies-17966/

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