[U/C] M2 North-South Motorway

[SBD]

Unless the amount raised is significantly more than is currently spent on transport projects (in total), then "legislation should be in place to ensure that 100% of funds collected by this means goes into funding these projects" means absolutely nothing, as he top-up funding from other sources can be reduced back such that the total spend is no different than now, just that some of the money spent has a traceable origin.

[Aidan]

I don't think it's tollways themselves that are unpopular; rather it's retrospectively applying them to existing roads (even when those roads are being upgraded).

With hindsight, the Southern Expressway should've been constructed as a two way tollway from the start — a toll wouldn't've been much more unpopular than making it one way only. But once there was an established user base, imposing a toll became politically impossible even when combined with making it two way.

[bits]

I believe the unpopular thing is the view that the road only benefits the car/truck users of the road.

Tolls do not account for increased economic activity increasing tax collection, increases in available jobs, increases in land value and decreases in traffic on similar alternative routes.
Tolls are such a ineffective instrument in collecting money from those that will benefit.

There is fairer taxes already in place to collect money for state and nation improvement. Increase them if there is some case that there is additional money people should pony up.

If you can't make a business case for increasing existing taxes there is no business case for collecting tolls.

[Aidan]

I believe the unpopular thing is the view that the road only benefits the car/truck users of the road.

Tolls do not account for increased economic activity increasing tax collection, increases in available jobs, increases in land value and decreases in traffic on similar alternative routes.
Tolls are such a ineffective instrument in collecting money from those that will benefit.

There is fairer taxes already in place to collect money for state and nation improvement. Increase them if there is some case that there is additional money people should pony up.

If you can't make a business case for increasing existing taxes there is no business case for collecting tolls.

Tolls don't need to account for increased economic activity etc. But business cases for toll roads can. Capturing more of the value can strengthen the business case, so your final argument is incorrect.

[SBD]

Putting a toll on an improved South Road might have some economic value (it is hard to work out how to model the scale of hat).

It will also divert some South Road traffic onto parallel roads such as Goodwood Road and Marion Road, leading to an increased need to upgrade those roads too. I guess that can be included in the model as increased economic activity too, but it's more government spending which is what was trying to be avoided in the first place/

[claybro]

Putting a toll on an improved South Road might have some economic value (it is hard to work out how to model the scale of hat).

It will also divert some South Road traffic onto parallel roads such as Goodwood Road and Marion Road, leading to an increased need to upgrade those roads too. I guess that can be included in the model as increased economic activity too, but it's more government spending which is what was trying to be avoided in the first place/

You forget that the "surface" South Road will still exist and carry less traffic due to the tollway, so I think those that don't wish to use the tollway, will just continue to use the existing South road as they normally would. I imagine the opposite may be true and the likes of Marion and Goodwood might see less traffic, due to the amount of extra capacity created by the tollway along South Road.

[Hooligan]

All of the mesh has been pulled down on the new Waterloo corner road/port Wakefield road intersection so you can now see the new interchange.

Looks like it is very close to being open.

[Mr Messy]

Google Earth 'historical' imagery has been updated to January 2019 for all of South road and up to Globe Derby Park.

[[Shuz]]

Just checked and everything looks the same still?

[Mr Messy]

Normal 2D view is still October 2017, but switching to historical imagery in the desktop program is relatively up to date

[Ser Noit of Loit]

Normal 2D view is still October 2017, but switching to historical imagery in the desktop program is relatively up to date

Gosh, Google Earth is advanced if it can have imagery from three days into the future!

[muzzamo]

Bitumen has gone done on a section of the lowered road near the southern expressway end.

Based on this as well as a recent newsletter I reckon there will be a switch to traffic flowing under flinders drive and Sturt Road (in one direction only) fairly soon.

[Ben]

The additional turning lane heading south into the new Bunnings at Edwardstown is almost complete. The Bunnings is so close to South Road there is no scope for widening.

Why this was approved is beyond my comprehension

[Nort]

The additional turning lane heading south into the new Bunnings at Edwardstown is almost complete. The Bunnings is so close to South Road there is no scope for widening.

Why this was approved is beyond my comprehension

It seems silly, but at the same time that section of road is so dense with large business sites that I can't imagine how it could be possible to not put a tunnel through that section.

[claybro]

My understanding is that the eastern side will be cleared to create enough space for surface roads and trench, or construction of an elevated road. This was before discussion of a tunnel gained momentum. It would be possible to have a two way service road along the western side with a trench to the east, but it would require removing all properties on the eastern side. Have to agree it is bewildering to see them continually allowing development along here, but this all comes down to a lack of forward planning, and specific timeframes for construction.