News & Discussion: Trams

[Hooligan]

To be fair wouldn't converting a heavy rail line into a light rail line essentially be a downgrade?

[SuperEgz]

http://indaily.com.au/news/2013/09/25/t ... oes-ahead/

Tram stop cafe to be removed if extension goes ahead
Liam Mannix | 25 September 2013


The Entertainment Centre tram stop. Photo: Nat Rogers/InDaily

Adelaide | Space at the Entertainment Centre Tram Stop has been approved for a café lease – but the approval contains a clause allowing the café to be removed if the tram extension to Port Adelaide ever goes ahead.

InDaily yesterday reported comments from the head of the State’s public transport services suggesting the café’s placement might present an impediment to the future extension of the tram line.

The café owner would have to remove the structure if the tram extension was approved in the future, a spokesperson for the Department of Planning, Transport and Infrastructure said in a statement released to InDaily this morning.

“DPTI has approved the lease of space for a proposed café,” the spokesperson said. “DPTI is encouraging a mobile operation, however, final approval is a matter for Council.

“DPTI’s approval is subject to an exclusionary clause that would require the removal of the building in the event the tramline is extended in the future.

“A contract for the operation of a café will not be completed until council approval is obtained by the proposed operator. Building the café is also the responsibility of the owner.”

Local Labor MP Michael Atkinson said he took up the issue with Transport Minister Tom Koutsantonis yesterday.

“The north west light rail project, coast to coast light rail, is part of my vision for the area I represent in parliament and I certainly don’t want anything done that would close off the possibility that at some time in the future we could get a budget allocation to enable this to happen,” he said.

“I made the point to the minister yesterday when I saw him in Parliament that I didn’t want anything that would close off the possibility of this vision. it’s not on the forward estimates, but we hope that at some time it will happen.”

The proposed café would be a “tilt-up” about the size of a small garden shed, according to City of Charles Sturt councillor Paul Alexandrides, who told InDaily he was aware of the proposal.

“I think it’s going to be a permanent structure,” Alexandrides said. “I don’t think I’d like to see something being driven on or off the median. That could be quite dangerous, to have a caravan type structure.

“It bolts together. It’s only a small structure, it’s half the size of a garden shed. It would be placed on site and the left in situ.

“It’s more or less just a couple of coffee machines and some breakfast snacks.”

Alexandrides said he wasn’t sure whether the final plan for the café had been lodged with Council for approval yet. He declined to name the person or business who had made the proposal.

DPTI CEO Rod Hook told the ABC this morning the café would have to be transportable.

“We’ve had an approach from someone who wants to put a cafe there,” Hook said.

“It’ll be either a transportable or mobile, probably a transportable. If it gets council approval, and it’s subject to council approval, we’re quite happy for people to set up commercial operations to sell coffee to customers.

“It’ll have to be at least transportable. It’ll be on condition that it will not preclude whatever options we’re funded to extend the tram line in the future.”

Executive director of Public Transport Services at the Department of Planning Transport and Infrastructure Bill Fragoulis told a public transport forum last Thursday he wasn’t sure what the café’s approval signalled about any future intentions to extend the tram line.

“We’ve just given approval to build a cafe right at the end of the entertainment centre, so I don’t know what that means in terms of continuing that tram line,” Fragoulis said.

“With the tram network, that’s why I was really careful in saying we’ve just given approval at the Entertainment Centre to build a cafe right at the end.

“I don’t know what that says. I’d like more extensions to the tram network, and we’re still evaluating whether tram is the way to go all the way out to Outer Harbour, to Port Adelaide.”

[monotonehell]

The Entertainment Centre extension isn't a white elephant. It provides PT to the Entertainment Centre for events, and an inner city general service from the CBD down North Tce to Port Road. The parallel railway line is useless for that as there are no stops between Adelaide Railway Station and Bowden - plus it terminates at the railway station.

[Nathan]

The Entertainment Centre extension isn't a white elephant. It provides PT to the Entertainment Centre for events, and an inner city general service from the CBD down North Tce to Port Road. The parallel railway line is useless for that as there are no stops between Adelaide Railway Station and Bowden - plus it terminates at the railway station.

Not to mention the service to the emerging medical precinct and Bonython Park - which whilst not important right now, certainly will be in the near future.

[how good is he]

If they were smart they could build the cafe alongside the existing elevated public waiting platform...so its long and narrow and between any potential future tram tracks....therefore if/when the tram gets extended they wouldn't have to move anyway....but that would be too much common sense...

[monotonehell]

If they were smart they could build the cafe alongside the existing elevated public waiting platform...so its long and narrow and between any potential future tram tracks....therefore if/when the tram gets extended they wouldn't have to move anyway....but that would be too much common sense...

There's plenty of room between the tracks.

[Vee]

Any tram buffs care to comment on the possibility of extending our tram network with wire-free trams?

Great article in the Climate Spectator by Matthew Wright.
It involves supercapacitor technology, wire-free tram networks with quick contact-less recharging, requiring only a '15-20kW supply at each stop'.

Huge impact on planning, construction costs, aesthetics and energy savings. The article explains the technology and the many benefits and includes examples of this evolving technology from other places.
A few snippets from this extended article.

It’s a revolution, Melbourne trams could go wire-free

... cities across the globe are going wire-free, building new tram networks without overhead lines ...

Although not currently cheap, the cost of supercapacitors is expected to drop considerably over the next couple of years.....

This supercapacitor revolution in trams...
has
... the potential to be a cheap solution to the congestion problems plaguing Australian cities...

Climate Spectator:
http://www.businessspectator.com.au/art ... -wire-free

[jk1237]

it does appear that the tram extension and conversion of the OH train line to light rail is years away, so Id say just keep it heavy rail, and divert the tram more into the heart of Bowden/Brompton. For an inner city suburb that is now quite medium density and will get even more density, there are sections that are no where near the train station or bus stop, ie would be atleast a 15-20 min walk which is pretty bad. For example the streets behind the Brompton Park hotel have a long walk to get to Bowden station, Port Rd or Hawker St bus stops. And these are quite med density housing. Not good IMO as people are forced to be as car dependant as those in the outer suburbs

[PeFe]

From my understanding of tram technology, wire free is more expensive and uses "proprietary" technology i.e. if you use company A' S system you are stuck with it, as compared to wires, "catenary", every company makes trams that fit this system. Adelaide uses Bombardier Flexitys and Alstoms Citadis on the same line.

[jk1237]

It appears that traffic light sequences at KW/Pirie and KW/Hindley Street intersections have been altered to speed up trams. Hoo-bloody-ray. Fix the others while your at it. The city trams are like an excrutiatingly slow turtle, simply due to having last priority at lights

[monotonehell]

It appears that traffic light sequences at KW/Pirie and KW/Hindley Street intersections have been altered to speed up trams. Hoo-bloody-ray. Fix the others while your at it. The city trams are like an excrutiatingly slow turtle, simply due to having last priority at lights

I said it back before this whole tram debacle started... monorail!
There's nothing like a bonafide six car monorail. It would glide over traffic like an ice skater. It wouldn't have to stop at traffic lights!
Sing it with me folks... monorail! monorail! monorail!
Sorry jk but the AdelaideNow mob has spoken!

Mono... d'oh!

monorail.png (244.12 KiB) Viewed 3673 times

[ghs]

Monorails don't seem to be popular. We don't have any in Australia - the one in Sydney closed
down last year. I would imagine that it's a lot cheaper to build a tram line or train line.

[Aidan]

Monorails don't seem to be popular. We don't have any in Australia - the one in Sydney closed
down last year. I would imagine that it's a lot cheaper to build a tram line or train line.

Are you sure we don't have any in Australia? Don't we still have the former Brisbane one that's now on the Gold Coast going nowhere much?

Monorails are generally the best value option for self contained routes that are entirely elevated, but elevated routes are not usually well suited to residential areas. Light rail is far more versatile.

[Nathan]

Monorails biggest problem is *that* Simpsons episode. Even in situations that they would be suitable for, their perception is completely shot.

Is there still one at Sea World?

[ChillyPhilly]

Monorails don't seem to be popular. We don't have any in Australia - the one in Sydney closed
down last year. I would imagine that it's a lot cheaper to build a tram line or train line.

Didn't the Sydney one get sent to Hobart?