COM: Glenelg Tramline Upgrade

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shuza
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#556 Post by shuza » Mon Apr 30, 2007 11:42 am

As great as all the tram hype is. I'd want something done with our railway system first.

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#557 Post by rogue » Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:34 pm

Will409 wrote:
bmw boy wrote:- North Adelaide, down oconell street

-The east end turning right on Nth Tce past adelaide uni and the RAH.. which could also go down to Norwood
I do agree that those route options should be explored (especially the line down the eastern end of North Terrace) but I do think some extensions beyond the CBD other then the Port line should be explored. Extension considerations should be based on bus patronage figures and distance. The top 5 bus routes in regards to patronage within 10kms of the CBD should be explored. The higher carrying capacity of the trams should be utilised and run to current or even superior bus frequencies on the selected routes. Where practical, the widest and straightest roads should be used (meaning some possible route alteration) so seperate tram 'lanes' like the ones being constructed in the CBD can be used. Normal tram lanes may be used beyond about 3kms from the CBD (with reserved tram lanes inside the 3km buffer) to reduce tram running times because of road congestion. Where possible, reserve track running (like on the Glenelg line) should be used to further speed up the timetable.

A bonus of adding tramlines out into the suburbs is a larger number of buses are then freed up allowing for better services on other bus routes or replacing the older buses in the fleet with newer buses that were displaced by the trams.
Part of the reason trams cant head up O'Connell Street is beacuse the bridge that crosses the Torrens cant handle the weight. The bridge will need to be replaced within the next 10 years anyway because of increasing vehicle traffic. So maybe after that we can have trams head up there...

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#558 Post by JAKJ » Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:18 pm

rogue wrote:
Will409 wrote:
bmw boy wrote:- North Adelaide, down oconell street

-The east end turning right on Nth Tce past adelaide uni and the RAH.. which could also go down to Norwood
I do agree that those route options should be explored (especially the line down the eastern end of North Terrace) but I do think some extensions beyond the CBD other then the Port line should be explored. Extension considerations should be based on bus patronage figures and distance. The top 5 bus routes in regards to patronage within 10kms of the CBD should be explored. The higher carrying capacity of the trams should be utilised and run to current or even superior bus frequencies on the selected routes. Where practical, the widest and straightest roads should be used (meaning some possible route alteration) so seperate tram 'lanes' like the ones being constructed in the CBD can be used. Normal tram lanes may be used beyond about 3kms from the CBD (with reserved tram lanes inside the 3km buffer) to reduce tram running times because of road congestion. Where possible, reserve track running (like on the Glenelg line) should be used to further speed up the timetable.

A bonus of adding tramlines out into the suburbs is a larger number of buses are then freed up allowing for better services on other bus routes or replacing the older buses in the fleet with newer buses that were displaced by the trams.
Part of the reason trams cant head up O'Connell Street is beacuse the bridge that crosses the Torrens cant handle the weight. The bridge will need to be replaced within the next 10 years anyway because of increasing vehicle traffic. So maybe after that we can have trams head up there...
I find that hard to believe, since that bridge can take a fully ladden truck, bus, and has had trams run over it for a good 40 yrs before the network was pulled up... From my reading about the history of the city bridge, was that it was built at tremendous expense (very controversial at the time) and very much over engineered.

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#559 Post by Will409 » Wed May 02, 2007 7:53 am

TransportSA has update the page with information on King William Street. Looks like they are gearing up to do King William Street sooner then later.
Image
TransportSA wrote: Traffic conditions will change on King William Street, between North Terrace and Flinders-Franklin streets, from the evening of Friday 4 May 2007. This is to allow preliminary works to be undertaken, within the future tramline corridor, before major construction works begin.

The following changes will take place on King William Street from Friday, 4 May 2007:

Safety barriers will be installed along the tramline corridor to create a safe working area for contractors.
The two centre traffic lanes (one lane in each direction) will no longer be available for use by motorists and speed restrictions will apply.
• The current peak-hour ban on right turn movements from King William Street will be extended to 24 hours a day. This ban will affect the intersections of Pirie and Waymouth streets, Currie and Grenfell streets and for southbound motorists travelling along Hindley and Franklin streets.
Turning left from King William Street into Waymouth Street will continue to be temporarily banned, between 7 am and 7 pm, while the kerbside lane in King William Street is occupied by a private construction company working on the City Central project.
Please refer to map above for details of these restrictions.

During this time, suggested alternative routes for motorists turning right off King William Street are Pultney or Morphett streets. Motorists who do not need to access the CBD can use alternative ring routes such as Robe Terrace, Fullarton Road, Greenhill Road and Port Road etc.

The preliminary works involve removal of the median and flagpoles, plus installation of new electrical conduits. The median strip will be reinstated including replacement of the garden beds following the construction works.

The project claims King William Street and North Terrace as road corridors where priority will be given to public transport.
Flyer about the work:
http://www.transportsa.com.au/tramexten ... 300407.pdf

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#560 Post by Tom » Wed May 02, 2007 10:33 am

Tramworks restart 18th May with tracklaying starting just north of Rundle Mall and thru to Franklin Street.

In relation to the Adelaide Bridge.... It was strengthened to take trams and still has these supports.

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#561 Post by bmw boy » Wed May 02, 2007 11:14 am

whether or not the bridge can support it right now...i think it should be improved or replaced to cater for trams to Nth Adelaide especially now that the Makris Le Cornu site has now been granted major project status.
Last edited by bmw boy on Wed May 02, 2007 11:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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#562 Post by urban » Wed May 02, 2007 11:27 am

shuza wrote:I dont like either of the alternative routes proposed for the city loop. Traffic reliance in Adelaides CBD is just ridiculous and PT should be encouraged at all costs. Thats why if a tramline went down West Terrace
I think they are using Gray St instead of West Tce for more reasons other than just appeasing the RAA & co (although I'm sure this is the main reason)
- Reduced track distance giving reduced construction, maintenance and running costs and reduced travelling time.
- Safer access for tram patrons (don't have to cross 3or 4 lanes to get to tram)
- Gray St actually has a greater catchment area because it draws people from both sides of the road

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#563 Post by rhino » Wed May 02, 2007 11:37 am

urban wrote: - Gray St actually has a greater catchment area because it draws people from both sides of the road
I thought the same thing. It's a much more practical route. I wonder if Gray St will be closed to vehicular traffic and just become a dedicated tram route with 2 tracks - they would take up most of the street wouldn't they?
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#564 Post by Will409 » Wed May 02, 2007 12:39 pm

Just dug up some more info off the TransportSA site. Looks like they will not be adding the curve from King William Street to North Terrace until the June long weekend but they will be doing ALL of King William Street in one move. I have heard rumours of doing King William Street in 2 sections but if this is anything to go by, they are going to be doing an almost super human effort. You have all seen how fast North Terrace was done, just imagine KWS!
TransportSA wrote: Further major construction works

The next stage of major construction works will involve track construction in King William Street, which is scheduled for the weekend of 18 May 2007.

The curved track at the King William Street and North Terrace intersection will be installed on the June long weekend, which will require the full closure of this intersection. Resurfacing of the road pavements in North Terrace and King William Street will also be scheduled over the next few weeks after the tram tracks have been installed.

The major track works in Victoria Square will be undertaken over a weekend in July 2007.

The major track works in King William Street will take place in a similar way to the first two stages on North Terrace with King William Street closed to through traffic during the construction weekends. During these works, one lane in each direction will be available for motorists to access local businesses.

Further details of these major construction works will be provided at a later date.

Changes to bus stops and taxi rank facilities

Following the major construction works on North Terrace the following bus stops and taxi ranks have been relocated to accommodate the new tram tracks.

Bus stop X1 on the southern side of North Terrace adjacent to the UniSA City West campus will be moved approximately 20 metres to the west, resulting in a loss of the permit parking zone on the southern side for up to three cars.
Bus stop C1 on the northern side of North Terrace adjacent to the City Skate Park will be moved approximately 20 metres to the west, resulting in the loss of some car parking on the northern side (approximately seven cars).
Bus stop W2 on the southern side adjacent to the EDS building will remain unchanged, however some services from other stops on North Terrace will be moved here. Refer to the stage 2 bus stop and taxi rank relocations.
The taxi rank on the northern side adjacent to the Convention Centre will be reduced from 10 taxis to three taxis, subject to final design of the Victoria Street junction traffic signals.
The part-time taxi rank/bus stop (D) on the northern side adjacent to the Hyatt Hotel will remain unchanged (i.e. a bus stop from 6 am to 12.30 am and a taxi zone at other times).
Bus stop (D3) for city-free buses outside the railway station will be moved several metres to the west to outside SkyCity with a full-time taxi zone for four cars in front of it. These bus stop and taxi zones will be relocated in between two new pedestrian crossings either side of the new platform at the Adelaide Railway Station tram stop.
Bus stop W1 on the southern side adjacent to Roma Mitchell House (RMH) will be moved 10 metres to the east between the two new pedestrian crossings.
Bus stop V1 for the Port Road buses will remain as is. It is expected that when the trams are running and the Bee Line bus is no longer in operation, buses currently servicing stop V1 will be moved to bus stop W1 adjacent to RMH.
It is proposed that the part-time bus stop/taxi zone on the southern side adjacent to the Stamford will remain in the same location until trams start running and the Bee Line bus service stops. Taxis will then use stop V1 which will become a full time taxi zone. The current taxi and bus zone adjacent the Stamford hotel is to be converted to part time passenger loading zone and part time taxi zone but this is still being negotiated with the Adelaide City Council.
[/quote]

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shuza
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#565 Post by shuza » Wed May 02, 2007 4:16 pm

Oooooh, not long now! :)
That bridge has been around for years, it can hold anything. Considering I've seen multi trucks on that bridge at any one time and it hasn't collapsed. Cars on it don't make much difference, and since trams used to run along it, nor would they. If anything, it'll probably just have strength upgrades.

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#566 Post by Cruise » Wed May 02, 2007 4:59 pm

Why no left turn to to Waymouth street?

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#567 Post by Ho Really » Wed May 02, 2007 5:47 pm

Cruise Control wrote:Why no left turn to to Waymouth street?
I guess it has to do with the City Central Tower 2 construction going on the ex-Advertiser site.

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#568 Post by AG » Wed May 02, 2007 6:31 pm

That move to block left turns into Waymouth Street makes sense. They've already blocked one lane of King William Street for City Central 2 construction, and with another lane about to be taken out of action, they'd want to keep traffic flowing as smoothly as possible, rather than having queues formed behind cars waiting for pedestrians as they turn left.

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#569 Post by rev » Thu May 03, 2007 1:37 pm

urban wrote:
shuza wrote:I dont like either of the alternative routes proposed for the city loop. Traffic reliance in Adelaides CBD is just ridiculous and PT should be encouraged at all costs. Thats why if a tramline went down West Terrace
I think they are using Gray St instead of West Tce for more reasons other than just appeasing the RAA & co (although I'm sure this is the main reason)
- Reduced track distance giving reduced construction, maintenance and running costs and reduced travelling time.
- Safer access for tram patrons (don't have to cross 3or 4 lanes to get to tram)
- Gray St actually has a greater catchment area because it draws people from both sides of the road
Wouldnt a pedestrian overpass sort that out? But I guess thats answered in the cost part of your post.

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#570 Post by AtD » Fri May 04, 2007 1:15 pm

Rev, how many people would bother going up a flight of stairs just to cross a two lane road?

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