[PRO] Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

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TrebleSketch
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[PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#61 Post by TrebleSketch » Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:36 pm

Eurostar wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:39 pm
ChillyPhilly wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 5:51 pm
I'd love to see freight and even interstate passenger services relocated from the Belair and Gawler lines - they form a significant barrier for pedestrians and other movements in the case of long trains, plus the route through the Hills is slow and inefficient. However, at the same time I'd love to see interstate rail return to the CBD. It's a big conflict.

The best solution is for the GlobeLink rail route to happen, but for a new interstate line to the CBD - be it a tunnel or not. I'll do a map when I have a chance.
As for passenger train between Adelaide and Melbourne I believe the only way it could compete with planes is be competitive on price and have a overnight train
Currently, the future of Overland beyond the end of this year is uncertain. As you can't book any tickets next year now, due to the uncertainty of funding from both the SA Libs and Vic Lab governments. I would prefer train over coach any day if I were to be travelling between the two cities in the future.

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[PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#62 Post by Eurostar » Tue Dec 03, 2019 7:26 am

(TrebleSketch)Currently, the future of Overland beyond the end of this year is uncertain. As you can't book any tickets next year now, due to the uncertainty of funding from both the SA Libs and Vic Lab governments. I would prefer train over coach any day if I were to be travelling between the two cities in the future.
Maybe a train service between Adelaide and Melbourne and vice versa should be run by a State Government or different company as a no frills service.

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[PRO] Re: [PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#63 Post by Mr Messy » Tue Dec 03, 2019 8:11 am

Eurostar wrote:
(TrebleSketch)Currently, the future of Overland beyond the end of this year is uncertain. As you can't book any tickets next year now, due to the uncertainty of funding from both the SA Libs and Vic Lab governments. I would prefer train over coach any day if I were to be travelling between the two cities in the future.
Maybe a train service between Adelaide and Melbourne and vice versa should be run by a State Government or different company as a no frills service.
There are several problems which combine to make the Overland less attractive than just driving:
Parklands terminal is near nothing
It takes substantially longer than driving
The drive is happily achievable in one day, compared with Sydney to Melbourne/Brisbane which is a very very long drive

The lower population compared to the eastern cities also mean less passengers compared to other routes.
I could see the Overland working as a sleeper service with the right marketing

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[PRO] Re: [PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#64 Post by TrebleSketch » Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:14 pm

Mr Messy wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 8:11 am
Eurostar wrote:
(TrebleSketch)Currently, the future of Overland beyond the end of this year is uncertain. As you can't book any tickets next year now, due to the uncertainty of funding from both the SA Libs and Vic Lab governments. I would prefer train over coach any day if I were to be travelling between the two cities in the future.
Maybe a train service between Adelaide and Melbourne and vice versa should be run by a State Government or different company as a no frills service.
There are several problems which combine to make the Overland less attractive than just driving:
Parklands terminal is near nothing
It takes substantially longer than driving
The drive is happily achievable in one day, compared with Sydney to Melbourne/Brisbane which is a very very long drive

The lower population compared to the eastern cities also mean less passengers compared to other routes.
I could see the Overland working as a sleeper service with the right marketing
In all honesty, I would really love to see the broad gauge tracks be converted back to standard gauge. Would just make so many things easier, plus would allow interstate service to terminate at Platform 1, if it is long enough. Will need to check if it's possible! As an overnight service, it'll work pretty well.

Though if that happens, do wonder what will happen with the Parkland Terminal... Maybe used more as a place to park the trains between services. Plus a major revamp of Adelaide Railway Station will be needed, though I don't see it happening until the City Train Loop is built... If ever, to be honest :wallbash:

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[PRO] Re: [PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#65 Post by SBD » Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:27 am

TrebleSketch wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:14 pm
Mr Messy wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 8:11 am
Eurostar wrote: Maybe a train service between Adelaide and Melbourne and vice versa should be run by a State Government or different company as a no frills service.
There are several problems which combine to make the Overland less attractive than just driving:
Parklands terminal is near nothing
It takes substantially longer than driving
The drive is happily achievable in one day, compared with Sydney to Melbourne/Brisbane which is a very very long drive

The lower population compared to the eastern cities also mean less passengers compared to other routes.
I could see the Overland working as a sleeper service with the right marketing
In all honesty, I would really love to see the broad gauge tracks be converted back to standard gauge. Would just make so many things easier, plus would allow interstate service to terminate at Platform 1, if it is long enough. Will need to check if it's possible! As an overnight service, it'll work pretty well.

Though if that happens, do wonder what will happen with the Parkland Terminal... Maybe used more as a place to park the trains between services. Plus a major revamp of Adelaide Railway Station will be needed, though I don't see it happening until the City Train Loop is built... If ever, to be honest :wallbash:
Which broad gauge tracks do you want converted back to standard gauge? Adelaide-Melbourne was the first intercolonial city railway that did not have a break-of-gauge, as the entire route was built to broad gauge. It was converted to standard gauge (by a different route the other side of Ballarat) in 1995.

Adelaide's train network has always been broad gauge, although most of the tram network was standard gauge (the Glenelg broad gauge railway became the standard gauge tram in 1929).

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[PRO] Re: [PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#66 Post by TrebleSketch » Wed Dec 04, 2019 12:47 pm

SBD wrote:
Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:27 am
TrebleSketch wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:14 pm
Mr Messy wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 8:11 am
There are several problems which combine to make the Overland less attractive than just driving:
Parklands terminal is near nothing
It takes substantially longer than driving
The drive is happily achievable in one day, compared with Sydney to Melbourne/Brisbane which is a very very long drive

The lower population compared to the eastern cities also mean less passengers compared to other routes.
I could see the Overland working as a sleeper service with the right marketing
In all honesty, I would really love to see the broad gauge tracks be converted back to standard gauge. Would just make so many things easier, plus would allow interstate service to terminate at Platform 1, if it is long enough. Will need to check if it's possible! As an overnight service, it'll work pretty well.

Though if that happens, do wonder what will happen with the Parkland Terminal... Maybe used more as a place to park the trains between services. Plus a major revamp of Adelaide Railway Station will be needed, though I don't see it happening until the City Train Loop is built... If ever, to be honest :wallbash:
Which broad gauge tracks do you want converted back to standard gauge? Adelaide-Melbourne was the first intercolonial city railway that did not have a break-of-gauge, as the entire route was built to broad gauge. It was converted to standard gauge (by a different route the other side of Ballarat) in 1995.

Adelaide's train network has always been broad gauge, although most of the tram network was standard gauge (the Glenelg broad gauge railway became the standard gauge tram in 1929).
Just had a re-read at the history of Adelaide rail and I was mistaken. I thought they changed our passenger rail onto broad in the 90s, turns it was the other way around. From Broad to Standard in 1995 with the "One Nation" project. Though I would definitely like to see conversion of all rolling stock be moved onto Standard... Or just dual gauge from the current interstate lines to Adelaide Railway Station (ARS). At least a portion of it, to allow Interstate/Intercity trains to arrive in ARS!

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[PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#67 Post by Spotto » Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:45 am

Announcement of investigation works in January 2020.

P.S. I think it’s now time to rename this thread to Ovingham Level Crossing Removal
715E2460-5499-4722-90A8-4D78B36A83E4.jpeg

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[PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#68 Post by TrebleSketch » Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:45 pm

Spotto wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:45 am
Announcement of investigation works in January 2020.

P.S. I think it’s now time to rename this thread to Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

715E2460-5499-4722-90A8-4D78B36A83E4.jpeg
Ooooh, the wording within this media release is rather targetted at those who hoped for an inclusion of Hawker St level crossing into this project.

"some nearby side streets in close proximity to the level crossing"

Plus, it looks like they're looking into a rail-under road design.

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[PRO] Re: Torrens Road Grade Separation

#69 Post by Eurostar » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:26 am

TrebleSketch wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:45 pm
Spotto wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:45 am
Announcement of investigation works in January 2020.

P.S. I think it’s now time to rename this thread to Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

715E2460-5499-4722-90A8-4D78B36A83E4.jpeg
Ooooh, the wording within this media release is rather targetted at those who hoped for an inclusion of Hawker St level crossing into this project.

"some nearby side streets in close proximity to the level crossing"

Plus, it looks like they're looking into a rail-under road design.
Of course they'll go with rail under road design because they can estimate the cost based on recent rail under road projects

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[PRO] Re: Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

#70 Post by [Shuz] » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:46 am

I really hope they don't go with rail under road, when there is a whole chunk of land to the north side they can use for road over rail.
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[PRO] Re: Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

#71 Post by rhino » Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:09 am

[Shuz] wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:46 am
I really hope they don't go with rail under road, when there is a whole chunk of land to the north side they can use for road over rail.
You joking?

The original name of what is now the Bombay Bicycle Club was the Overway Hotel, so named because it was always intended to one day have an overpass there.
cheers,
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[PRO] Re: Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

#72 Post by Hooligan » Wed Dec 18, 2019 12:49 pm

[Shuz] wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:46 am
I really hope they don't go with rail under road, when there is a whole chunk of land to the north side they can use for road over rail.
A rail underpass opens up the opportunity to take the hawker street crossing out as well. Why would you not want that?

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[PRO] Re: Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

#73 Post by Nathan » Wed Dec 18, 2019 1:01 pm

Wouldn't it be far easier to leave the existing line at grade (particularly with the ARTC line), and extend the hill from Park Tce into an overpass? Or maybe it'll be a bit of both.

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[PRO] Re: Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

#74 Post by TrebleSketch » Wed Dec 18, 2019 1:15 pm

[Shuz] wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:46 am
I really hope they don't go with rail under road, when there is a whole chunk of land to the north side they can use for road over rail.
The reason why rail under road is the better option for this route is because it would make Hawker St LX removal a lot easier. Plus also would make the Park Terrace section a lot easier to redevelop as it was noted before that there isn't enough clearance for the overhead wires.

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[PRO] Re: Ovingham Level Crossing Removal

#75 Post by ChillyPhilly » Wed Dec 18, 2019 1:52 pm

I'm starting to think we'll see a combination:

- Road over, using the reservation on the north side of Torrens Road (especially west of the line), and
- The rail corridor between North Adelaide station and north of existing Ovingham station will be sunk slightly to accommodate electrics passing under Park Street.

I'm hopeful that North Adelaide and Ovingham stations are redeveloped, perhaps in tandem with the overall electrification project; the latter is more likely than the former.
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