[PRO] City Gates

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Aidan
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Aidan »

A much better use for the money would be to get the peak hour buses on North Terrace moving at a decent speed again by restoring the left turn lane to Frome Road that they expensively removed a few years ago!
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Nathan
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Nathan »

Aidan wrote:A much better use for the money would be to get the peak hour buses on North Terrace moving at a decent speed again by restoring the left turn lane to Frome Road that they expensively removed a few years ago!
Getting rid of that turn lane massively improved both the appearance of North Tce, and pedestrian safety. I believe it was one of Jan Gehl's recommendations from his first Adelaide report. I'd be very happy to see some other left turn slip lanes disappear - Botanic Rd & East Tce, and Victoria Dr & Frome Rd in particular.
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by crawf »

Nathan wrote:
Aidan wrote:A much better use for the money would be to get the peak hour buses on North Terrace moving at a decent speed again by restoring the left turn lane to Frome Road that they expensively removed a few years ago!
Getting rid of that turn lane massively improved both the appearance of North Tce, and pedestrian safety. I believe it was one of Jan Gehl's recommendations from his first Adelaide report. I'd be very happy to see some other left turn slip lanes disappear - Botanic Rd & East Tce, and Victoria Dr & Frome Rd in particular.
Another one.. King William and North Terrace intersection
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by claybro »

crawf wrote:^Heh, that has already been done :wink:

Forget tacky sculptures or a so called "city gate", just improve the actual landscaping. Some of the parklands section of Sir Donald Bradman Drive is surrounded by dead grass and overgrown trees, as is King William Road alongside Veale Gardens.
Could not agree more. Just spend the money on some decent irrigation, formal plantings and actually maintain it. Having visited last week, I know it has been dry over there, but FFS even some places that once had irrigation, the plants/grass is dead, and there are reticulation pipes hanging out of the ground all over the place. It is all over Adelaide as well not just the ACC areas. Mawson lakes landscaping is looking tacky as, dead trees, dry grass, dead plants. Purple recycled water pipes exposed clearly no longer connected, and yes, it is a pet hate of mine, because it is so easily/ cheaply rectified.
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Aidan »

Nathan wrote:
Aidan wrote:A much better use for the money would be to get the peak hour buses on North Terrace moving at a decent speed again by restoring the left turn lane to Frome Road that they expensively removed a few years ago!
Getting rid of that turn lane massively improved both the appearance of North Tce, and pedestrian safety.
Grassing over North Terrace would massively improve its appearance, but functionality is needed as well. Surely it shouldn't be too hard to design a left turn lane thhat looks OK?

As for pededstrian safety... how exactly? Doesn't having the left turning vehicles conflicting with a green pedestrian light make it more dangerous? The only safety advantage I can think of is that by causing traffic jams all along North Terrace, it makes it safer for pedestrians to cross midblock!
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Nathan »

Aidan wrote:
Nathan wrote:
Aidan wrote:A much better use for the money would be to get the peak hour buses on North Terrace moving at a decent speed again by restoring the left turn lane to Frome Road that they expensively removed a few years ago!
Getting rid of that turn lane massively improved both the appearance of North Tce, and pedestrian safety.
Grassing over North Terrace would massively improve its appearance, but functionality is needed as well. Surely it shouldn't be too hard to design a left turn lane thhat looks OK?

As for pededstrian safety... how exactly? Doesn't having the left turning vehicles conflicting with a green pedestrian light make it more dangerous? The only safety advantage I can think of is that by causing traffic jams all along North Terrace, it makes it safer for pedestrians to cross midblock!
Left turn slip lanes create massive conflicts with pedestrians. Cars are supposed to stop for any pedestrians crossing the slip lane, but the reality is that rarely happens. They even put a sign up reminding drivers at the Botanic Rd / East Tce lane — it's still ignored. It also creates conflicts with cyclists in the bike lane, as cars have to cross it to access the slip lane. I've had more near misses at Victoria Dr/Frome Rd than anywhere else in the city from just that situation.

You're also carving way pedestrian space to create additional road space. The resulting island is dead space, you can't really do much with it. In particularly busy areas of the city, what happens when there are more people waiting at the lights than fit safely on the island? Or you get into the absurd situation like the slip lane crossings on Port Rd near the city where a pedestrian needs to traverse four or five seperate lights just to cross the road.

From the report:
Another problem is the left turn from slip roads that are allowed in certain places in the city e.g. where North Terrace meets Frome Road. Here, cars in slip lanes are allowed to turn left without paying attention to the traffic lights. Even though they have to give way to pedestrians, this system creates extremely dangerous situations for pedestrians. This kind of traffic arrangement should not be allowed in the city where everyone should be able to walk safely on the streets. Fur- ther, this turning practice works against the development of a cycling culture. Also the speed at which some traffic move in slip lanes with a broad radius means that they are often trav- elling too fast e.g. around Hindmarsh Square.
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Wayno »

Waaaay back in 2008 i suggested small stone walls at all parkland intersections to 'frame up' the parklands. $3m would go a long way to achieving this goal. No matter where they put city gates (north, south, east west) someone will feel left out.

I'm proposing similar to what's already done here: https://www.google.com.au/maps/@-34.924 ... 312!8i6656.

You wouldn't hang a painting without a frame. Same concept. Nice entry point for cyclists and pedestrians and do away with the tardy border between the footpath and grassed area. Low stone walls also create nice areas for garden beds and plants.

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1976
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Patrick_27 »

Wayno wrote:Waaaay back in 2008 i suggested small stone walls at all parkland intersections to 'frame up' the parklands. $3m would go a long way to achieving this goal. No matter where they put city gates (north, south, east west) someone will feel left out.

I'm proposing similar to what's already done here: https://www.google.com.au/maps/@-34.924 ... 312!8i6656.

You wouldn't hang a painting without a frame. Same concept. Nice entry point for cyclists and pedestrians and do away with the tardy border between the footpath and grassed area. Low stone walls also create nice areas for garden beds and plants.

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1976
You fail to address why Adelaide needs this? Just a colossal waste of money IMO...
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by rev »

Patrick_27 wrote:
Wayno wrote:Waaaay back in 2008 i suggested small stone walls at all parkland intersections to 'frame up' the parklands. $3m would go a long way to achieving this goal. No matter where they put city gates (north, south, east west) someone will feel left out.

I'm proposing similar to what's already done here: https://www.google.com.au/maps/@-34.924 ... 312!8i6656.

You wouldn't hang a painting without a frame. Same concept. Nice entry point for cyclists and pedestrians and do away with the tardy border between the footpath and grassed area. Low stone walls also create nice areas for garden beds and plants.

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1976
You fail to address why Adelaide needs this? Just a colossal waste of money IMO...
That's like saying why do we need vegetation at all.

The whole point is to make the city and surrounds look aesthetically pleasing and attractive.
The parklands either need to be spruced up and actually become a realistic, key attraction to the city as a whole, or the dead crappy parts need to be developed and put to use.
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Llessur2002 »

I quite like the idea of creating some more formal entrances to parklands in busy areas. Might draw people in to a small extent...
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Norman
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Norman »

City Beautification is part and parcel of what a local government does. If it was the state or federal government, it might be a bit suss, but this is perfectly reasonable. News media just likes to point at anything that doesn't come with an EFTPOS machine and call it a waste of money.
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by OlympusAnt »

Speaking of North Terrace - also having it as a no parking zone from the Railway Station eastwards would help too
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by Mountaineer »

Would love to see a Gateway Arch like the one in St Louis, Missouri. Could be used as a "Gateway to the Outback" of sorts, and have elements of indigenous architecture to make it unique and relevant.
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by OlympusAnt »

How about planting a money tree :bow: :bow:
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[PRO] Re: City Gates

Post by SBD »

[OK, I'm slow catching up]
I don't see much point to this in general.
For locations, Sir Donald Bradman Drive is the main road to the CBD from the airport, but honestly, who is actually looking out of the taxi or shuttle bus window at the "gateway" when you arrive after a long flight?
Prospect currently makes sense as the main road from almost all of the country except Victoria, Tasmania and southeastern SA. However, when the Northern Connector, T2T and the bit at Regency Road is completed, what will be signposted to "Adelaide"? I'd guess it will be (Northern Expressway if needed), Northern Connector, Superway, Port Road. My navigation GPS suggested something like that the other day in evening peak hour already!
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