The SA Politics Thread

[claybro]

Stereotyping much?

Absolutely, and they just keep proving the stereotype dont they. All the while we try not to offend our "regional ally".. tone down our customs and stilfle free speach in order not to offend. Wake up Australia.

[rev]

Didn't we have a federal politics thread?
Oh well..

Senator Xenophon has been detained by Malaysia. Aren't they meant to be our allies and friends?
Lets see how the federal government handles this, given Xenophon hasn't exactly been a "yes man" for them.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/sout ... 6579351300

Call me a conspiracy theorist but, I think the Scientologists got him. Follow me here:
* Xenophon has made noises regarding the state of democracy in Malaysia.
* Xenophon has made a speech about the evils of Scientology.
* Someone took that speech and replaced the word "Scientology" with "Islam".
* Nick gets nicked in the airport as enemy of the state.

The thing is there's a whole load of Australian pollies heading over there now for talks on democracy in Malaysia. See if they get snagged as well.

Nick also took part in a pro-democracy protest last year or the year before, where he was tear gassed.
I thought there was a thing called diplomatic immunity? Surely he would have been traveling with diplomatic papers on him? How can they just detain a federal politician of another country, and hold him without allowing him to make a phone call, or go to the toilet without an armed guard escorting him? What is he, a wanted terrorist or serial killer?
Or is that just in the movies?

I wouldn't be surprised if Gillard and her gang had some involvement in it as well...probably more so then scientologists.

Stereotyping much?

Absolutely, and they just keep proving the stereotype dont they. All the while we try not to offend our "regional ally".. tone down our customs and stilfle free speach in order not to offend. Wake up Australia.

And for once I agree with you Claybro.
Unfortuantely I think by the time people wake up here, we will have a situation like they do in Europe.
The major issue I have is that these people they are letting in, via illegal arrivals, are unskilled and uneducated. Therefor they are more susceptible to extremism.
It's actually been made very very difficult for someone to come here legally through proper channels..
What the Australian, and South Australian governments should be doing, is making it easier and enticing Europeans and Americans to come here. People with an education and skills.
Not only would the government save money because these people will not sit on welfare and expect other government hand outs for years, they will actually work and contribute to the economy.

It's a win-win. Except for the globalizationists who are flooding western countries with third world people.

There's already parts of Australian cities that all you see is these people who arrived on boats...what's it going to look like in 10 or 20 years? Scary to even think about.

[claybro]

And if you think Rev's post is a little extreme, then consider an article recently on "white flight" out of London. Whole areas are being vacated by white British populations, because their systems and values are being discarded by their own government in favour of minorities. Our state and Federal Gov policies of apeasment are no different. If there is not a huge outrage about this, then we have rolled over, and abandoned free speach, and Western Democratic ideals. I hope Nick sues the pants off that paper that labled him anti Islamic, but I also hopes Nick learns not to be so accepting and trusting of this ever encroaching political/religious system as there is no separating the 2 in any Islamic society.

[Aidan]

Didn't we have a federal politics thread?
Oh well..

Senator Xenophon has been detained by Malaysia. Aren't they meant to be our allies and friends?
Lets see how the federal government handles this, given Xenophon hasn't exactly been a "yes man" for them.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/sout ... 6579351300

Call me a conspiracy theorist but, I think the Scientologists got him. Follow me here:
* Xenophon has made noises regarding the state of democracy in Malaysia.
* Xenophon has made a speech about the evils of Scientology.
* Someone took that speech and replaced the word "Scientology" with "Islam".
* Nick gets nicked in the airport as enemy of the state.

No, I don't think theres a conspiracy. The fact that Malaysia's dominated by Muslims means the Scientologists would have little to no influence there. Nor is there even a direct connection, as the misquoting of Xenophon's speech is well known to be s fraud. More likely it's to do with the Malaysian government's continued persecution of Anwar Ibrahim.

The thing is there's a whole load of Australian pollies heading over there now for talks on democracy in Malaysia. See if they get snagged as well.

Is there still? I know at least some have turned back in protest.

Nick also took part in a pro-democracy protest last year or the year before, where he was tear gassed.
I thought there was a thing called diplomatic immunity? Surely he would have been traveling with diplomatic papers on him? How can they just detain a federal politician of another country, and hold him without allowing him to make a phone call, or go to the toilet without an armed guard escorting him? What is he, a wanted terrorist or serial killer?
Or is that just in the movies?

Even if he was on a diplomatic passport, diplomatic immunity does not automatically secure the right to go anywhere. Malaysia has the legal right to expel Xenophon if it wishes, even though exercising that right is both wrong and stupid.

I wouldn't be surprised if Gillard and her gang had some involvement in it as well...probably more so then scientologists.

Gillard needs the support of the independents more than ever. She wouldn't dare risk it - not even Turnbull would be that reckless!

Absolutely, and they just keep proving the stereotype dont they. All the while we try not to offend our "regional ally".. tone down our customs and stilfle free speach in order not to offend. Wake up Australia.

And for once I agree with you Claybro.
Unfortuantely I think by the time people wake up here, we will have a situation like they do in Europe.
The major issue I have is that these people they are letting in, via illegal arrivals, are unskilled and uneducated. Therefor they are more susceptible to extremism.

Most of them are fleeing persecution by extremists, and are therefore less susceptible to extremism.

I think you've totally misdiagnosed the European situation.

Australia has a successful policy of multiculturalism: people are free to determine their own culture, and the government's roles include keeping the peace and promoting Australian values.
Europe just doesn't get it: they claim to have multiculturalism, but they think it's about everyone keeping the culture they started off with. That creates alienation, an "us and them" situation, and a cycle of resentment that extremists can and do exploit. Worse still, the governments give undue deference to the people they regard as community leaders, many of whom are of dubious character.

It's actually been made very very difficult for someone to come here legally through proper channels..
What the Australian, and South Australian governments should be doing, is making it easier and enticing Europeans and Americans to come here. People with an education and skills.

It's not that hard for people with education and skills to get here.

Not only would the government save money because these people will not sit on welfare and expect other government hand outs for years, they will actually work and contribute to the economy.

Most immigrants do no matter how they got here, but we should be doing more to get them into work sooner. There's far too much emphasis on restricting immigration, and too little on making it profitable.

It's a win-win. Except for the globalizationists who are flooding western countries with third world people.

Why should people from third world backgrounds be discriminated against?

There's already parts of Australian cities that all you see is these people who arrived on boats...what's it going to look like in 10 or 20 years? Scary to even think about.

20 years ago Adelaide's NW suburbs were full of people from Vietnam who'd arrived on boats. Now it looks like any other part of Adelaide. Your fear is unjustified.

[rev]

And if you think Rev's post is a little extreme, then consider an article recently on "white flight" out of London. Whole areas are being vacated by white British populations, because their systems and values are being discarded by their own government in favour of minorities. Our state and Federal Gov policies of apeasment are no different. If there is not a huge outrage about this, then we have rolled over, and abandoned free speach, and Western Democratic ideals. I hope Nick sues the pants off that paper that labled him anti Islamic, but I also hopes Nick learns not to be so accepting and trusting of this ever encroaching political/religious system as there is no separating the 2 in any Islamic society.

London is a great example. But there's more examples from London to Athens and everything in between.
Parts of German cities are no go zones if you are "white".
Illegal immigrants in Athens have demanded the government build them a mosque. Imagine the balls on these people, illegally in a country, demanding that government fund mosques for them. But then I guess it's no different to an Islamic Womens association here in Australia demanding the Australian government fund holidays for it's members back to their home countries..
Should I even mention the crime rate? Italy and Greece are good examples. Their prison populations are rather interesting for those who doubt it. Crime levels, and crimes that never used to happen, or happened so rarely in Greece, are now common place. And guess who the perpetrators are? Prisons are over flowing..that's how bad the situation has gotten.
Wanting Sharia law being introduced in the UK..
The list goes on and on..

Do people think that somehow we have managed to receive only the "good" ones?

People will call us racist or whatever..but the issue isn't race, or peoples skin colour.
The issue that I have is that these people are NOT accepting of Australian/Western values. These people do NOT contribute to Australia in any positive way. Unless you think more crime and ghettoizing suburbs is a positive contribution to Australia.
The majority of them anyway, will not integrate into Australian society. They don't want to. They have no desire to.

Australia's problem is that there has never been any great war or anything here like has happened in Europe and other parts of the world. So in a way, Australians are still very naive, which isn't helped by the fact that the politically correct left wing globalist plague has reached our shores too. It's like a little kid, all trusting and shit at first, till it get's burnt a few times and learns the hard way. Unfortunately that's going to have to happen here too. Once we get burnt a few times, hopefully, you'd think, people will wake up.

Too bad we don't have a third option to vote for that will actually put Australia, it's interests and it's people FIRST above all else.
(waits for the nazi remarks.. )

20 years ago Adelaide's NW suburbs were full of people from Vietnam who'd arrived on boats. Now it looks like any other part of Adelaide. Your fear is unjustified.

I live in the NW suburbs of Adelaide. It is still mostly Asian people who live here.
If by resemble any other part of Adelaide, you mean the style of houses, the streetscapes etc are similar, then yes. But other then that, I don't think there is any other place in Adelaide like the NW suburbs.
And I'm not saying any of that in a bad way. Just pointing out that you are wrong.

Why should people from third world backgrounds be discriminated against?

Never said they should. Why should they be allowed to come here illegally?

It's lucky we have the geography we do, and we have no land borders with any other countries, but are separated by hundreds of km's of ocean...otherwise the few thousand who do come here, would be over a hundred thousand annually quite easily.
But the downside of this semi isolation is the naivety of the populace.
Europe is finding out and experiencing first hand. We are getting a very small dose of it for the time being.

[claybro]

Australia did have a success of multiculturalism. Many nationalities have come, many religions have come. None of these peoples or religions have asked their host communities to change their way of life, culture or customs until we we have come to Islamic immigration. Governments of Islamic majority countries do not separate religion and government.They crush any suggestion of freedom of speech and any opposition parties that suggest a separation of religion and state. People who flee here from such countries also cannot see why they should separate our laws and customs from their religion. No other group of immigrants have caused such a fracture of thier host societies. No other group have chosen so deliberately to separate themselves from the way of life of their host societies. No other group has sought to have their own set of laws seperate to their hosts, in order to fit their religious beliefs. This latest incident should serve as a wake up call to us all.

[Nathan]

What the Australian, and South Australian governments should be doing, is making it easier and enticing Europeans and Americans to come here. People with an education and skills.

So return to the White Australia policy then? Anglo cultures don't have a monopoly on education and skills.

[Mants]

What the Australian, and South Australian governments should be doing, is making it easier and enticing Europeans and Americans to come here. People with an education and skills.

So return to the White Australia policy then? Anglo cultures don't have a monopoly on education and skills.

I think it's unfair to pick one or two sentences out of context and have a go at rev about it. I agree completely that emigration from Europe should be encouraged...why not? Some of the issues he raises are legitimate issues. My best friend was born in Britain, is now an Australian citizen and still has relatives living in London. Their grandmother is too afraid to leave her house because of a drastic increase in gang activity, especially over the last few years. These 'gangs' appear to consist of African immigrants of Islamic faith.

I dont wholly agree with either argument put forward. It is unreasonable to, as there are so many factors that could work in favour of either.
Religious discrimination is a huge problem in our society. This doesn't only apply to Muslims, but also to Christians, Sikhs, etc. I believe that there is good and bad in every race, every culture, every religion. However, antisocial behaviour must be discouraged and cannot be tolerated in a society like Australia.
Islamic immigrants have given a lot to our culture and way of life...look at areas like Brunswick in Melbourne...Sydney Road and its surrounds are culturally rich and full of life.
The muslims who I know love living here and want to add their traditions to the microcosm of Australian culture. Many of these muslims attended Catholic schools in Adelaide.
It is ignorant to infer that education, religion and skin colour go hand in hand. Read the papers...it seems likely that the next pope could be African.

[Aidan]

And if you think Rev's post is a little extreme, then consider an article recently on "white flight" out of London. Whole areas are being vacated by white British populations, because their systems and values are being discarded by their own government in favour of minorities.

Would that article be from the Daily Mail, perchance? Because that's notoriously unreliable. Although none of the British tabloids are entirely trustworthy.

Our state and Federal Gov policies of apeasment are no different.

What policies of appeasement?

If there is not a huge outrage about this, then we have rolled over, and abandoned free speach, and Western Democratic ideals. I hope Nick sues the pants off that paper that labled him anti Islamic, but I also hopes Nick learns not to be so accepting and trusting of this ever encroaching political/religious system as there is no separating the 2 in any Islamic society.

Clearly you missed the Shahbag protests (which were mainly in Bangladesh, but were participated in by Bangladeshis around the world including in Adelaide). I saw one on the King William side of Parliament House a few days ago.

London is a great example. But there's more examples from London to Athens and everything in between.
Parts of German cities are no go zones if you are "white".

I had no idea the standard of German policing was so bad.

Illegal immigrants in Athens have demanded the government build them a mosque. Imagine the balls on these people, illegally in a country, demanding that government fund mosques for them. But then I guess it's no different to an Islamic Womens association here in Australia demanding the Australian government fund holidays for it's members back to their home countries..

Demanding or requesting?

Would I be correct in deducing those illegal immigrants in Athens are in immigration detention and are therefore unable to access a mosque?

Should I even mention the crime rate? Italy and Greece are good examples. Their prison populations are rather interesting for those who doubt it. Crime levels, and crimes that never used to happen, or happened so rarely in Greece, are now common place. And guess who the perpetrators are? Prisons are over flowing..that's how bad the situation has gotten.
Wanting Sharia law being introduced in the UK..
The list goes on and on..

Do people think that somehow we have managed to receive only the "good" ones?

If you look at the circumstances in which the bad ones came to Europe, that's a more reasonable conclusion than it initially seems. It's rare for Islamists to be persecuted - they're far more likely to be the persecutors. And Australia's geographic position is such that they're unlikely to want to come here. As for common criminals, they should be treated just like any other criminals with the added threat of deportation.

People will call us racist or whatever..but the issue isn't race, or peoples skin colour.
The issue that I have is that these people are NOT accepting of Australian/Western values. These people do NOT contribute to Australia in any positive way. Unless you think more crime and ghettoizing suburbs is a positive contribution to Australia.
The majority of them anyway, will not integrate into Australian society. They don't want to. They have no desire to.

Struth, you sound like Pauline Hanson! You're making racist assumptions without any basis in fact.

Australia's problem is that there has never been any great war or anything here like has happened in Europe and other parts of the world

That's not Australia's problem. If anything it's Europe's problem.

So in a way, Australians are still very naive, which isn't helped by the fact that the politically correct left wing globalist plague has reached our shores too. It's like a little kid, all trusting and shit at first, till it get's burnt a few times and learns the hard way. Unfortunately that's going to have to happen here too. Once we get burnt a few times, hopefully, you'd think, people will wake up.

Of course we should always guard against political correctness - but fortunately it never really caught on in Australia the way it did in other western countries.

Too bad we don't have a third option to vote for that will actually put Australia, it's interests and it's people FIRST above all else.

The Bobcats are the latest in a long line of parties claiming to be that third option.

(waits for the nazi remarks.. )

Putting Australia first doesn't mean telling everyone else to FOAD.

I live in the NW suburbs of Adelaide. It is still mostly Asian people who live here.

So why the fear?

Why should people from third world backgrounds be discriminated against?

Never said they should. Why should they be allowed to come here illegally?

They shouldn't - they should be allowed to come here legally. But when they're not safe in their country of origin or on the way here, they shouldn't be persecuted for entering illegally. Apart from anything else, they have rights under international law.

It's lucky we have the geography we do, and we have no land borders with any other countries, but are separated by hundreds of km's of ocean...otherwise the few thousand who do come here, would be over a hundred thousand annually quite easily.
But the downside of this semi isolation is the naivety of the populace.
Europe is finding out and experiencing first hand. We are getting a very small dose of it for the time being.

Europe is implementing idiotic PC pseudomulticulturalism. Australia has proper multiculturalism, which solves the problems rather than exacerbating them

[rev]

What the Australian, and South Australian governments should be doing, is making it easier and enticing Europeans and Americans to come here. People with an education and skills.

So return to the White Australia policy then? Anglo cultures don't have a monopoly on education and skills.

You do realize I'm not an Anglo-Australian? Why would I advocate a return to a White Australia policy, especially since I have relatives who are Aboriginal? I have a family that is as multicultural as Australian society.

The reason I picked Europe and America, is because of the economic situation in those regions. Jobs aren't exactly easy to come by over there these days, and in parts of Europe there are thousands of people who are highly educated but jobless. THESE are the sorts of people our governments SHOULD be targeting for emigration. Why? Not because they are "White", but because they are highly educated and will contribute to the Australian economy and our society in positive ways.

What is the point of bringing over people who are unskilled and uneducated and struggle to speak a word of English because they have no interest or intent on learning it let alone integrating into our society?
Just to be politically correct and appear to "care" about others plights?

The Sunday Night program on 7 last night had a bit about Bangladesh and the ship yards where they disassemble them in, by hand and with no safety regulations, working with toxic chemicals with no protection etc. Often it's kids who are doing the dangerous work.
I'd rather our government spent money bringing up the standard of living and helping those countries improve the quality of life for their people, then bring those people here.
At least that way those people actually would have their lives improved.

And if you think this is about peoples skin colour, then think again. I also think our Kiwi neighbors shouldn't be flown over on FIFO rosters to work in mines, while hundreds of thousands of Australians are unemployed.

What's in Australia's interests? An army of uneducated, unskilled people who cant speak, read or write English.....or migrants who are educated, skilled, and can speak English..?

I had no idea the standard of German policing was so bad.

As I said I got a multicultural family.

Demanding or requesting?

Would I be correct in deducing those illegal immigrants in Athens are in immigration detention and are therefore unable to access a mosque?

I'm talking about the ones free on the streets...it's a messed up situation.
There's hundreds of thousands of them, in detention, in camps, all over the place. Western European countries, where these people want to go, wont accept them.

And demanding is the right word.

If you look at the circumstances in which the bad ones came to Europe, that's a more reasonable conclusion than it initially seems. It's rare for Islamists to be persecuted - they're far more likely to be the persecutors. And Australia's geographic position is such that they're unlikely to want to come here

Yeh, right. We only get the "good ones", no extremists have managed to sneak in.
Wait till their numbers rise some more..Australia is in for a big shock.

Struth, you sound like Pauline Hanson! You're making racist assumptions without any basis in fact.

I was aiming more Hitleresque. Damn it.

Of course we should always guard against political correctness - but fortunately it never really caught on in Australia the way it did in other western countries.

Aha, it's bad enough.

Putting Australia first doesn't mean telling everyone else to FOAD.

I didn't say we should tell everyone else to FOAD.
I said we should be targeting people who are going to be a benefit to Australia. And I used Europe and America with their economic crisis' as an example of where to source such people.

So why the fear?

What is this fear you keep referring to?

They shouldn't - they should be allowed to come here legally. But when they're not safe in their country of origin or on the way here, they shouldn't be persecuted for entering illegally. Apart from anything else, they have rights under international law.

Funny how Indonesia, the point of origin of the boats, does sweet fuck all to stop the boats and people smugglers. Of course, when there's money on offer from Australia...

Don't you find it odd how these people have tens of thousands of dollars to pay to people smugglers..?
You do realize that they aren't taking a boat from their war torn countries direct to Australia right? That the smugglers move them around several countries before putting them on an Indonesian boat headed for our shores?
They spend most of their journey away from their war torn country or away from the persecution they are fleeing.

Tens of thousands of dollars to pay off people smugglers.....

Interesting eh?

Europe is implementing idiotic PC pseudomulticulturalism. Australia has proper multiculturalism, which solves the problems rather than exacerbating them

Australia's multiculturalism has worked thus far because the majority of people have been Caucasians from other parts of Europe. So once the prejudices where overcome, it wasn't that hard to integrate.

You now have people who are completely different and have no, or very few, cultural similarities with the majority of Australia.

You wait twenty years, and you'll see just how bad it's going to get.
People will then be saying multiculturalism has failed in Australia.

[claybro]

What policies of appeasement?

Does it not bother you that an Australian politician has just been deported from a neighbour and supposed ally, and our government did not even summon their ambassador for a please explain? Whilst I dont think this should be ramped up beyond diplomatic circles, I wonder what would happen if The Advertiser ran an slanderous article about one of their politicians, and then we deported said politician from our shores. As for Rev's commentary about the situation in Europe, well he is quite correct. A local Turkish Islamic group in Austria wanted alcohol banned on certain days from their local ski area, as the drinking of alcohol offended them. They even tried to engage the Catholic Church to further thier cause saying that alchohol should not be consumed on Sundays as a foot in the door for a total ban. The Catholic Church, trying to appear considerate to another religion, gave muted approval to the proposal, but were told to sod off by the locals, even in Tyrol the most Catholic of lands. I have been openly told by a Turk there, that what Islam failed to do by war 600 years ago, they are now doing to Austria by immigration. These people are not fleeing persecutution in their homelands, they actively see it as their duty to spread Islam. It is time that as Australians, we started politely pushing back.

[monotonehell]

*sigh*

[peas_and_corn]

Could the past couple of pages be split into its own thread? As mentioned the first time the Xenophon issue was raised this isn't a state matter but one of federal importance. So... please sequester it to its own thread

[Shahkar]

I'll be looking forward to the speeches next month. See what each side brings forward.

[Waewick]

well it is good to hear Wetherill justifying an increase in cost of public transport by saying he's made it easier on people who owned a car....