SA Economy

[SBD]

AGL is one of the largest operators of coal and gas power stations, and a shareholder in one of the largest renewable energy operators (Tilt Renewables). AGL seems to be planning closure of its big coal and gas (Torrens Island in SA) power stations in favour of more wind farms, batteries, and small peaking fossil fuel (Barker Inlet) power stations to top up the gaps. It's not doing that because coal power stations are cheaper to operate.

its doing that because of the Paris accord and associated incentives

its all artificial

AGL is not a party to the Paris Agreement.

Snowy Hydro is owned by the Commonwealth Government (which is a party to the agreement). It owns hydro, and some gas and diesel peaking plants. Tilt Renewables owns wind farms and is owned 20% by AGL and 40% the Australian Future Fund.

The government seems to be trying to keep coal power stations open, not close them earlier than the planned service life.

[abc]

AGL is one of the largest operators of coal and gas power stations, and a shareholder in one of the largest renewable energy operators (Tilt Renewables). AGL seems to be planning closure of its big coal and gas (Torrens Island in SA) power stations in favour of more wind farms, batteries, and small peaking fossil fuel (Barker Inlet) power stations to top up the gaps. It's not doing that because coal power stations are cheaper to operate.

its doing that because of the Paris accord and associated incentives

its all artificial

AGL is not a party to the Paris Agreement.

Snowy Hydro is owned by the Commonwealth Government (which is a party to the agreement). It owns hydro, and some gas and diesel peaking plants. Tilt Renewables owns wind farms and is owned 20% by AGL and 40% the Australian Future Fund.

The government seems to be trying to keep coal power stations open, not close them earlier than the planned service life.

AGL doesn't need to be a party to it, the government are and this determines what is profitable for them or not

[rubberman]

its doing that because of the Paris accord and associated incentives

its all artificial

AGL is not a party to the Paris Agreement.

Snowy Hydro is owned by the Commonwealth Government (which is a party to the agreement). It owns hydro, and some gas and diesel peaking plants. Tilt Renewables owns wind farms and is owned 20% by AGL and 40% the Australian Future Fund.

The government seems to be trying to keep coal power stations open, not close them earlier than the planned service life.

AGL doesn't need to be a party to it, the government are and this determines what is profitable for them or not

AGL is closing those stations. They are privately owned, and the owners can shut them down. That's what happened with the power stations at Port Augusta.

Their decision to close the plants is economic. They can't get anyone who can do the maths to finance them. If we want coal plants, it's only Government that will fund them. If we wanted that, we shouldn't have sold them.

Funnily enough, if the Federal Government of the day had seriously believed in nuclear power (rather than as a cynical time wasting exercise), it could have started the process in 2016. That was when we were told those stations at PA were closing down. However, when it had the opportunity to do it, 8 years ago, and with the chance of having a nuclear plant, it didn't. With that went any chance of nuclear being able to come on line as coal plants retired.

So, pardon me if I doubt the crocodile tears of those who had the opportunity to advance nuclear...and didn't, and whose party was responsible for the early closure of the Port Augusta stations. SA's economy is vulnerable to power prices and shortages. However, if we'd left it to the anti-renewables lobby, we'd have no power and no economy.

[abc]

AGL is not a party to the Paris Agreement.

Snowy Hydro is owned by the Commonwealth Government (which is a party to the agreement). It owns hydro, and some gas and diesel peaking plants. Tilt Renewables owns wind farms and is owned 20% by AGL and 40% the Australian Future Fund.

The government seems to be trying to keep coal power stations open, not close them earlier than the planned service life.

AGL doesn't need to be a party to it, the government are and this determines what is profitable for them or not

AGL is closing those stations. They are privately owned, and the owners can shut them down. That's what happened with the power stations at Port Augusta.

Their decision to close the plants is economic. They can't get anyone who can do the maths to finance them. If we want coal plants, it's only Government that will fund them. If we wanted that, we shouldn't have sold them.

Funnily enough, if the Federal Government of the day had seriously believed in nuclear power (rather than as a cynical time wasting exercise), it could have started the process in 2016. That was when we were told those stations at PA were closing down. However, when it had the opportunity to do it, 8 years ago, and with the chance of having a nuclear plant, it didn't. With that went any chance of nuclear being able to come on line as coal plants retired.

So, pardon me if I doubt the crocodile tears of those who had the opportunity to advance nuclear...and didn't, and whose party was responsible for the early closure of the Port Augusta stations. SA's economy is vulnerable to power prices and shortages. However, if we'd left it to the anti-renewables lobby, we'd have no power and no economy.

sigh...

[rubberman]

AGL doesn't need to be a party to it, the government are and this determines what is profitable for them or not

AGL is closing those stations. They are privately owned, and the owners can shut them down. That's what happened with the power stations at Port Augusta.

Their decision to close the plants is economic. They can't get anyone who can do the maths to finance them. If we want coal plants, it's only Government that will fund them. If we wanted that, we shouldn't have sold them.

Funnily enough, if the Federal Government of the day had seriously believed in nuclear power (rather than as a cynical time wasting exercise), it could have started the process in 2016. That was when we were told those stations at PA were closing down. However, when it had the opportunity to do it, 8 years ago, and with the chance of having a nuclear plant, it didn't. With that went any chance of nuclear being able to come on line as coal plants retired.

So, pardon me if I doubt the crocodile tears of those who had the opportunity to advance nuclear...and didn't, and whose party was responsible for the early closure of the Port Augusta stations. SA's economy is vulnerable to power prices and shortages. However, if we'd left it to the anti-renewables lobby, we'd have no power and no economy.

sigh...

That's your answer?

How about you come up with something remotely credible?

Energy policy is critical to SA. Yet when failed policies, and the politicians who pursued them are pointed out, you don't want to discuss them? Well, that's a great way to get fooled...again.

We could have a nuclear plant half built already for those who truly believe that's a realistic option. Whether I agree or not. The guy who is spruiking it had his chance. It's too late.

No practical solutions there. Just a...sigh.

[rev]

For f sake, can someone just ban these two idiots from seeing/responding to each others posts already? Or just ban them both for a month or something.
how many threads are going to be turned into the abc/rubberman circus.

[gnrc_louis]

Why? Discussion seems the whole point of a forum?

[rubberman]

Why? Discussion seems the whole point of a forum?

Indeed. It is the Pub here, after all.

However, I'd be quite happy for there to be guidelines for civility at least.

[rubberman]

For f sake, can someone just ban these two idiots from seeing/responding to each others posts already? Or just ban them both for a month or something.
how many threads are going to be turned into the abc/rubberman circus.

This is the Pub forum.

You can put us on ignore. That would not bother me in the least.

[rev]

Because this is a thread for the economy, and it's being turned into another abc-rubberman specialty, where the majority of posts are shit posts about nuclear and renewables, whose to blame, whose better labor or liberal.
Same shit from the electricity thread carrying over into every other thread these two lock horns in.
It's the same argument over and over.

Instead of everyone else always having to be inconvenienced by this rubbish, how about you two take it to PM.

I had a few things ECONOMY related I was going to post the last couple days, but didn't bother because the thread is full of your irrelevant bickering and personality clashes.

[rubberman]

Because this is a thread for the economy, and it's being turned into another abc-rubberman specialty, where the majority of posts are shit posts about nuclear and renewables, whose to blame, whose better labor or liberal.
Same shit from the electricity thread carrying over into every other thread these two lock horns in.
It's the same argument over and over.

Instead of everyone else always having to be inconvenienced by this rubbish, how about you two take it to PM.

I had a few things ECONOMY related I was going to post the last couple days, but didn't bother because the thread is full of your irrelevant bickering and personality clashes.

Lol.

Fact. YOU posted multiple articles about power prices. That's YOU.

So, now someone discusses an issue YOU brought up...with someone else, and now you have a problem?

As I said. If people offend you for expressing their opinions, use the block button. That's what it's for. If you use the block button, you won't see any discussion from people whose opinions you dislike. The "thread being full" excuse is irrelevant, because you won't see it.

Further. Looking through the thread that started with YOU posting about electricity prices, I cannot find any comment on either side that is uncivil.

So, what exactly is the problem here? A civil debate, starting from something YOU posted on the Pub forum is a really weird thing to complain about.

[rev]

Christ all mighty. There really needs to be a better ignore/block function on this forum.

[Waewick]

Christ all mighty. There really needs to be a better ignore/block function on this forum.

There is. You should use it.

So should everyone else.

[SouthAussie94]

Because this is a thread for the economy, and it's being turned into another abc-rubberman specialty, where the majority of posts are shit posts about nuclear and renewables, whose to blame, whose better labor or liberal.
Same shit from the electricity thread carrying over into every other thread these two lock horns in.
It's the same argument over and over.

Instead of everyone else always having to be inconvenienced by this rubbish, how about you two take it to PM.

I had a few things ECONOMY related I was going to post the last couple days, but didn't bother because the thread is full of your irrelevant bickering and personality clashes.

This thread had discussion about Dairy Exports, Gather Round and the Commsec State of the States report. Minimal mention of electricity until you posted the following:

Australia’s highest electricity costs hold SA back in business cost report
South Australia is being held back by nation-leading energy costs in a ranking of business-friendly states.

No one replied.

You followed this up with the following

But but but wind turbines and solar panels will bring down the cost of power and save the universe...
I'd laugh if the situation wasn't so dire and sad.

Leading regional businesses hit with surging power bills as the country’s highest electricity costs cripple the agriculture industry.
Leading regional South Australian businesses have been hit with surging power bills as the country’s highest electricity costs cripple the agriculture industry and send staple produce prices soaring.

It's a bit silly to now have a whinge about the the discussion you started just because you disagree with the sentiment and the direction its gone.

[rev]

Yes, no shit, I posted some articles about the cost of electricity. They were in relation to businesses. You know without businesses, we pretty much don't have much of an economy.



What would YOU do Southaussie93 to fix things?
You asked me, yet didn't tell us what you would do.

Here's your chance..